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If you are capable, please help us to create good quality subtitles: https://c3subtitles.de/talk/744 Thanks! 1 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:15,589 France has seen a number 2 00:00:15,590 --> 00:00:18,529 of radicalized attacks in the past year, 3 00:00:18,530 --> 00:00:20,749 our hearts has gone out, have gone out 4 00:00:20,750 --> 00:00:23,029 to our French friends, 5 00:00:23,030 --> 00:00:25,189 especially during the Paris attacks 6 00:00:25,190 --> 00:00:27,949 in 2015, in November 2015, 7 00:00:27,950 --> 00:00:30,019 and a niece on Bastille Day of this 8 00:00:30,020 --> 00:00:31,099 year. 9 00:00:31,100 --> 00:00:33,349 Since November 2015, 10 00:00:33,350 --> 00:00:35,629 France has been under a state 11 00:00:35,630 --> 00:00:37,969 of emergency and the French society 12 00:00:37,970 --> 00:00:41,179 has seen a number of drastic changes. 13 00:00:41,180 --> 00:00:43,369 Friends is now a police state, and 14 00:00:43,370 --> 00:00:45,469 with that came and very 15 00:00:45,470 --> 00:00:47,689 extensive and intrusive surveillance 16 00:00:47,690 --> 00:00:49,039 framework. 17 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:50,959 And if we're looking at the upcoming 18 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,359 French presidential election in 19 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:55,429 the spring of 2017 20 00:00:55,430 --> 00:00:57,589 and the rising popularity of the far 21 00:00:57,590 --> 00:00:59,839 right, we see 22 00:00:59,840 --> 00:01:02,329 that there is a serious need for a debate 23 00:01:02,330 --> 00:01:04,458 on privacy rights, freedom 24 00:01:04,459 --> 00:01:06,619 of expression, and also on France's 25 00:01:06,620 --> 00:01:08,719 own national motto, which 26 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:10,459 is the center of the French democratic 27 00:01:10,460 --> 00:01:11,510 values system, 28 00:01:12,740 --> 00:01:14,869 liberty, equality, 29 00:01:14,870 --> 00:01:16,489 fraternity. 30 00:01:16,490 --> 00:01:18,589 And what about privacy? 31 00:01:18,590 --> 00:01:21,049 So today we have with us achiness 32 00:01:21,050 --> 00:01:23,449 and Chris from LaGuardia to 33 00:01:23,450 --> 00:01:26,509 the Net and they will start 34 00:01:26,510 --> 00:01:29,719 framing the debate with their questions. 35 00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:31,549 And we hope that you will have a chance 36 00:01:31,550 --> 00:01:33,379 to add to that after the talk. 37 00:01:33,380 --> 00:01:35,690 Please help me welcome Agnes and Chris. 38 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,159 Hi, everyone, thank you for coming. 39 00:01:48,160 --> 00:01:50,649 It's a great honor to be here. 40 00:01:50,650 --> 00:01:52,869 Let's start with something 41 00:01:52,870 --> 00:01:54,099 fun. 42 00:01:54,100 --> 00:01:56,469 Actually, yesterday we kind of revamped 43 00:01:56,470 --> 00:01:59,199 the whole talk and maybe 44 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:01,389 this title could have changed 45 00:02:01,390 --> 00:02:02,709 it to something like this. 46 00:02:02,710 --> 00:02:05,499 As we were talking so much about friends, 47 00:02:05,500 --> 00:02:08,019 we should have called it like Privacy 48 00:02:08,020 --> 00:02:09,020 Baggot. 49 00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:12,759 So, you know, for the 50 00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:13,760 let's talk. 51 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:15,639 So let's be honest. 52 00:02:15,640 --> 00:02:17,229 Let's be honest. 53 00:02:17,230 --> 00:02:19,119 Things are quite bad in France for 54 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:20,120 freedom. 55 00:02:20,650 --> 00:02:22,059 They are taking a bad direction. 56 00:02:22,060 --> 00:02:24,249 And it's actually not 57 00:02:24,250 --> 00:02:26,379 easy to know exactly where 58 00:02:26,380 --> 00:02:27,969 the line between this is. 59 00:02:27,970 --> 00:02:30,999 Fine and it's really bad is 60 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:32,349 living every day in France. 61 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,709 It's difficult to say if we have already 62 00:02:35,710 --> 00:02:38,499 drifted too far or 63 00:02:38,500 --> 00:02:41,109 from what we know, people are suffering 64 00:02:41,110 --> 00:02:43,719 and liberties are under attack. 65 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,419 But the very fact that 66 00:02:46,420 --> 00:02:48,249 we are here to talk about this is a good 67 00:02:48,250 --> 00:02:49,329 news. 68 00:02:49,330 --> 00:02:51,909 We can still talk about democracy 69 00:02:51,910 --> 00:02:53,539 and challenge the power. 70 00:02:53,540 --> 00:02:54,969 So let's do it. 71 00:02:54,970 --> 00:02:57,189 So back in 2012, President 72 00:02:57,190 --> 00:02:58,749 Hollande has been elected. 73 00:02:58,750 --> 00:03:01,059 His program was, well, left 74 00:03:01,060 --> 00:03:03,219 wing. But since the arrival of Manuel 75 00:03:03,220 --> 00:03:06,129 Valls as a prime minister in July 2014, 76 00:03:06,130 --> 00:03:08,319 it illustrated a security turn for 77 00:03:08,320 --> 00:03:10,719 the government since that French 78 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:12,459 government policies were strongly 79 00:03:12,460 --> 00:03:14,829 oriented towards more surveillance 80 00:03:14,830 --> 00:03:17,859 and more what they call security. 81 00:03:17,860 --> 00:03:19,989 Our goal is to invert the trend, 82 00:03:19,990 --> 00:03:21,879 to document what is going on so we can 83 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:24,459 remember in all political world 84 00:03:24,460 --> 00:03:26,769 where everything is buzzing when the EU 85 00:03:26,770 --> 00:03:29,019 in the US election, we are even 86 00:03:29,020 --> 00:03:31,869 speaking about the post Truth World, 87 00:03:31,870 --> 00:03:34,059 where memory is documentation. 88 00:03:34,060 --> 00:03:36,609 They are of utmost importance, 89 00:03:36,610 --> 00:03:38,769 a little bit like the pigs in Orwell's 90 00:03:38,770 --> 00:03:40,059 Animal Farm. 91 00:03:40,060 --> 00:03:41,799 More and more politicians are playing 92 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:43,689 with memories and changing their minds 93 00:03:43,690 --> 00:03:45,249 every two years. 94 00:03:45,250 --> 00:03:47,079 Well, it isn't new that people in 95 00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:49,299 positions of power are trying to rewrite 96 00:03:49,300 --> 00:03:50,289 history. 97 00:03:50,290 --> 00:03:52,479 However, it's no more and more difficult 98 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:54,399 to keep track of those changes, 99 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:56,469 especially when on a long term 100 00:03:56,470 --> 00:03:58,899 basis, information is so quickly buried 101 00:03:58,900 --> 00:04:00,849 and there are massive amounts of order 102 00:04:00,850 --> 00:04:02,649 type of information. 103 00:04:02,650 --> 00:04:04,209 In this talk. 104 00:04:04,210 --> 00:04:06,339 We are focused on 105 00:04:06,340 --> 00:04:08,589 French laws that have been adopted in the 106 00:04:08,590 --> 00:04:10,749 past three years and 107 00:04:10,750 --> 00:04:13,839 that are infringing fundamental 108 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:15,099 rights in France. 109 00:04:15,100 --> 00:04:17,919 In the digital area, 110 00:04:17,920 --> 00:04:19,809 of course you better get gadgety 111 00:04:19,810 --> 00:04:22,479 fraternity, but also privacy, 112 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:24,579 which is not in the national model, 113 00:04:24,580 --> 00:04:26,389 but it's still a fundamental rights under 114 00:04:26,390 --> 00:04:27,429 mind. 115 00:04:27,430 --> 00:04:29,499 So there are too many 116 00:04:29,500 --> 00:04:31,569 laws that are legally causing all liberty 117 00:04:31,570 --> 00:04:33,849 to decrease at an alarming rate. 118 00:04:33,850 --> 00:04:35,979 Most of them have a strong impact 119 00:04:35,980 --> 00:04:38,619 on Internet use, whether it's metadata 120 00:04:38,620 --> 00:04:41,199 gathering, surveillance or censorship. 121 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:43,419 We can easily say that France is up 122 00:04:43,420 --> 00:04:45,729 to date to the most techniques 123 00:04:45,730 --> 00:04:48,129 of policing the Internet. 124 00:04:48,130 --> 00:04:50,859 Instead of doing a review of 125 00:04:50,860 --> 00:04:52,270 each law specifically 126 00:04:53,560 --> 00:04:55,949 that was adopted in the last three years. 127 00:04:55,950 --> 00:04:58,599 I would like to focus on the consequences 128 00:04:58,600 --> 00:04:59,600 of this close 129 00:05:00,670 --> 00:05:03,219 as France as France 130 00:05:03,220 --> 00:05:05,859 adopted very strong security measures 131 00:05:05,860 --> 00:05:08,679 even before 2015 132 00:05:08,680 --> 00:05:10,659 and the terror attacks. 133 00:05:10,660 --> 00:05:13,359 So, first of all, a problem on 134 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:14,980 data retention and access. 135 00:05:18,890 --> 00:05:21,079 Low since, well, law 136 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:24,019 enforcement and administrative authority 137 00:05:24,020 --> 00:05:26,539 can have now a wider access to metadata 138 00:05:26,540 --> 00:05:29,389 returned by hosting providers 139 00:05:29,390 --> 00:05:32,029 and ISP for broad purposes, 140 00:05:32,030 --> 00:05:34,519 such as a defense of permission 141 00:05:35,570 --> 00:05:37,669 and for the defense and the permission 142 00:05:37,670 --> 00:05:39,769 of the fundamental fundamental 143 00:05:39,770 --> 00:05:40,910 interests of France. 144 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:43,080 So here 145 00:05:45,230 --> 00:05:46,230 we are 146 00:05:48,890 --> 00:05:51,169 before well before the adoption 147 00:05:51,170 --> 00:05:54,259 of the surveillance law in 2015, 148 00:05:54,260 --> 00:05:56,239 there were only few administration that 149 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,729 had access to intelligence techniques. 150 00:05:58,730 --> 00:06:01,639 This is the surveillance law results 151 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:04,249 and this slide which shows 152 00:06:04,250 --> 00:06:06,499 or the administration 153 00:06:06,500 --> 00:06:08,689 services that have access to intelligence 154 00:06:08,690 --> 00:06:11,539 techniques, which is 155 00:06:11,540 --> 00:06:12,540 lots of them, 156 00:06:13,850 --> 00:06:15,799 this and this slide is not up to date 157 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:18,199 because since 158 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:19,380 it has been done, a 159 00:06:20,420 --> 00:06:22,519 new administration that such as 160 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,189 a penitentiary, authorities 161 00:06:25,190 --> 00:06:27,409 have also access to those type of 162 00:06:27,410 --> 00:06:28,339 techniques. 163 00:06:28,340 --> 00:06:30,199 Basically, those are the techniques that 164 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:31,839 are allowed in that Aldo's 165 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:35,309 administration to have access to. 166 00:06:35,310 --> 00:06:37,489 So it's not very easy to read 167 00:06:37,490 --> 00:06:39,349 because it's a very, very big image. 168 00:06:39,350 --> 00:06:41,569 You can find it on our wiki of credits 169 00:06:41,570 --> 00:06:43,549 at the end of this presentation, Yuusuke, 170 00:06:43,550 --> 00:06:44,549 you'll find a link. 171 00:06:44,550 --> 00:06:45,949 So basically you have here the minister 172 00:06:45,950 --> 00:06:48,649 of defense with all the 173 00:06:48,650 --> 00:06:50,719 administration around, the minister 174 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:53,359 of interior around here and 175 00:06:53,360 --> 00:06:54,919 around here, the minister of finance and 176 00:06:54,920 --> 00:06:56,389 now the Ministry of Justice with the 177 00:06:56,390 --> 00:06:57,439 penitentiary. 178 00:06:57,440 --> 00:06:59,899 Authorities have also access 179 00:06:59,900 --> 00:07:01,879 to that type of technique. 180 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,609 So what technique are we talking about 181 00:07:04,610 --> 00:07:06,739 those techniques? Well, they are what 182 00:07:06,740 --> 00:07:09,049 they were calling are legal that are not 183 00:07:09,050 --> 00:07:10,489 illegal because there is no law to 184 00:07:10,490 --> 00:07:11,749 prohibit them. 185 00:07:11,750 --> 00:07:13,669 But they were used without any legal 186 00:07:13,670 --> 00:07:14,689 safeguards. 187 00:07:14,690 --> 00:07:16,459 They intrude privacy. 188 00:07:16,460 --> 00:07:18,679 And, um, although there 189 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:21,349 is oversight agency 190 00:07:21,350 --> 00:07:23,869 having to check on how 191 00:07:23,870 --> 00:07:25,369 those techniques are being used and 192 00:07:25,370 --> 00:07:27,649 implemented, it has no real power 193 00:07:27,650 --> 00:07:29,749 to forbid the use of one of 194 00:07:29,750 --> 00:07:30,859 those techniques. 195 00:07:30,860 --> 00:07:32,949 Those tools gather well, analysis of 196 00:07:32,950 --> 00:07:35,509 encrypted communications, key loggers, 197 00:07:35,510 --> 00:07:37,429 Internet probes into the backbone of the 198 00:07:37,430 --> 00:07:39,619 network, AMC Cultures 199 00:07:39,620 --> 00:07:41,359 and so on and so on. 200 00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:43,579 Well, there is also very weak and 201 00:07:43,580 --> 00:07:45,889 complicated judicial redress to be put 202 00:07:45,890 --> 00:07:47,749 forth to protect citizens of that. 203 00:07:47,750 --> 00:07:49,759 As a matter of fact, all secret 204 00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,429 surveillance is difficult to prove 205 00:07:52,430 --> 00:07:54,649 and to attack then it's public 206 00:07:54,650 --> 00:07:57,439 knowledge, although that several years 207 00:07:57,440 --> 00:07:59,629 from several years the French secret 208 00:07:59,630 --> 00:08:01,739 services were carrying surveillance on 209 00:08:01,740 --> 00:08:03,799 the international submarine cables, 210 00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:05,959 illegal surveillance with no 211 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:07,489 public debate and no law. 212 00:08:07,490 --> 00:08:09,619 That's why it was illegal, even though 213 00:08:09,620 --> 00:08:11,479 we had sufficient evidence that this 214 00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:13,819 system existed since 2008. 215 00:08:13,820 --> 00:08:15,889 The lawsuit brought to the council, Ed, 216 00:08:15,890 --> 00:08:17,989 the Supreme Administrative Court was 217 00:08:17,990 --> 00:08:19,399 dismissed with no scrutiny. 218 00:08:20,450 --> 00:08:22,519 And of course, 219 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:25,039 now international communications are 220 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:26,040 intercepted, 221 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:28,220 but now with the law, 222 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:31,429 but still with no judicial 223 00:08:31,430 --> 00:08:34,009 redress and no real oversight. 224 00:08:34,010 --> 00:08:36,288 And here, for example, the 225 00:08:36,289 --> 00:08:37,289 MEPs of 226 00:08:38,570 --> 00:08:40,639 what a court case before the concert at 227 00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:43,099 the Administrative Supreme 228 00:08:43,100 --> 00:08:44,100 Administrative Court. 229 00:08:45,140 --> 00:08:48,439 And this court case was also dismissed. 230 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:50,719 Basically, the same written that she 231 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:53,089 asked and she treated my Assyrians, 232 00:08:53,090 --> 00:08:55,219 France. I request control procedure for 233 00:08:55,220 --> 00:08:57,169 the National Commission for the Control 234 00:08:57,170 --> 00:08:59,239 of Intelligence Technique, which 235 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:01,289 the name in French is the sea and city 236 00:09:01,290 --> 00:09:03,379 are the commission that 237 00:09:03,380 --> 00:09:05,489 in that control the technique, the whole 238 00:09:05,490 --> 00:09:07,669 cinema was treated on fourth May 239 00:09:07,670 --> 00:09:09,739 2016. 240 00:09:09,740 --> 00:09:13,519 Next consequences will censorship 241 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,129 with the terrorism law of 2014 242 00:09:16,130 --> 00:09:18,169 France. It will reinforce the offense of 243 00:09:18,170 --> 00:09:20,299 apology of terrorism, which is the 244 00:09:20,300 --> 00:09:22,249 glorification of Terrorism Act and 245 00:09:22,250 --> 00:09:24,889 terrorism speech. 246 00:09:24,890 --> 00:09:27,079 This offense is even more sanctioned 247 00:09:27,080 --> 00:09:28,340 if committed online. 248 00:09:30,500 --> 00:09:32,629 Yeah, and here you have 249 00:09:32,630 --> 00:09:34,309 the United Nations report 250 00:09:35,630 --> 00:09:37,819 on the use of the Internet 251 00:09:37,820 --> 00:09:39,559 for terrorism purposes. 252 00:09:39,560 --> 00:09:41,809 And it's written that 253 00:09:43,370 --> 00:09:45,709 it's specific but specific 254 00:09:45,710 --> 00:09:48,319 on an apology of terrorism, 255 00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:50,479 which says that some intergovernmental 256 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:52,549 and human rights mechanism 257 00:09:52,550 --> 00:09:54,529 I've expressed that the concept of 258 00:09:54,530 --> 00:09:55,969 glorification of terrorism is 259 00:09:55,970 --> 00:09:58,309 sufficiently narrow and precise 260 00:09:58,310 --> 00:10:00,409 to serve as a basis for criminal 261 00:10:00,410 --> 00:10:01,699 sanctions, compliant with the 262 00:10:01,700 --> 00:10:03,859 requirements of the principle of 263 00:10:03,860 --> 00:10:06,709 legality and the permissible limitations 264 00:10:06,710 --> 00:10:08,899 of the right to freedom of expression. 265 00:10:08,900 --> 00:10:12,379 So this is important because 266 00:10:12,380 --> 00:10:14,479 this means that France, France 267 00:10:14,480 --> 00:10:16,549 does not comply with 268 00:10:16,550 --> 00:10:18,999 that. Ocean and consider that anything 269 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:21,179 in the scope of apology of terrorism 270 00:10:21,180 --> 00:10:23,459 is illegal. Illegal and 271 00:10:23,460 --> 00:10:25,679 of course, with no definition really 272 00:10:25,680 --> 00:10:27,689 finished off, what is apology of 273 00:10:27,690 --> 00:10:28,690 terrorism? 274 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:32,999 The problem is it's not only in France 275 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:35,129 because the EU directive 276 00:10:35,130 --> 00:10:37,439 for combating terrorism, which 277 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:38,440 is 278 00:10:39,630 --> 00:10:41,789 going to be adopted very soon at the 279 00:10:41,790 --> 00:10:43,470 EU level, 280 00:10:44,790 --> 00:10:47,249 is going in the exact 281 00:10:47,250 --> 00:10:48,569 same way. 282 00:10:48,570 --> 00:10:49,570 And 283 00:10:51,450 --> 00:10:53,339 and then it will be applied in all the 284 00:10:53,340 --> 00:10:53,919 countries. 285 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:56,249 So still, without definition 286 00:10:56,250 --> 00:10:58,049 of what is apology of terrorism, 287 00:11:00,420 --> 00:11:03,539 we shall not forget that a key difficulty 288 00:11:03,540 --> 00:11:05,669 is to identify where 289 00:11:05,670 --> 00:11:08,339 the line of acceptability lies 290 00:11:08,340 --> 00:11:10,319 because it varies greatly from country to 291 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:12,479 country, depending on cultural and 292 00:11:12,480 --> 00:11:13,319 legal history. 293 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:15,779 So apology of terrorism won't be this 294 00:11:15,780 --> 00:11:17,939 won't be exactly the same in 295 00:11:17,940 --> 00:11:20,279 one country and in another one. 296 00:11:20,280 --> 00:11:23,009 So and still no definition 297 00:11:23,010 --> 00:11:25,259 in none of the countries. 298 00:11:25,260 --> 00:11:27,299 Speaking of numbers, as we are geeks and 299 00:11:27,300 --> 00:11:31,199 we like numbers, between 1984 300 00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:33,359 and 2014, there 301 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:36,359 have been 14 people sentenced 302 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:38,519 for with the offense of apology 303 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:41,009 of terrorism in 2015. 304 00:11:41,010 --> 00:11:44,249 So in one year there has been 336 305 00:11:44,250 --> 00:11:46,859 people sentence with that offense, 306 00:11:46,860 --> 00:11:49,049 considering then one third 307 00:11:49,050 --> 00:11:50,279 of the people that have been 308 00:11:51,390 --> 00:11:52,289 sentenced. 309 00:11:52,290 --> 00:11:54,179 I've been sentenced on the sole 310 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,059 offense of apology of terrorism. 311 00:11:57,060 --> 00:11:58,679 That means that people are getting 312 00:11:58,680 --> 00:12:01,499 sentence of a very serious sanctions 313 00:12:01,500 --> 00:12:03,689 for merely going on a website 314 00:12:03,690 --> 00:12:05,609 or posting a statement on a social 315 00:12:05,610 --> 00:12:06,610 network. 316 00:12:08,740 --> 00:12:11,169 Now, let's talk about police powers. 317 00:12:11,170 --> 00:12:14,469 So since November 2015 318 00:12:14,470 --> 00:12:17,559 and the terrorist attacks in France, 319 00:12:17,560 --> 00:12:19,689 France in is in under a 320 00:12:19,690 --> 00:12:20,830 state of emergency, 321 00:12:22,060 --> 00:12:23,199 which is still ongoing. 322 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:26,229 So this state of emergency 323 00:12:26,230 --> 00:12:29,109 has been extended already five times 324 00:12:29,110 --> 00:12:32,859 and it will last until July 2017. 325 00:12:32,860 --> 00:12:34,330 So it will be almost 326 00:12:35,830 --> 00:12:37,899 two years and we don't know if it 327 00:12:37,900 --> 00:12:39,570 won't be extended again. 328 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:42,970 It could be, at least for the moment. 329 00:12:44,980 --> 00:12:46,989 It's the state of emergency is an 330 00:12:46,990 --> 00:12:49,299 exceptional set of power that was 331 00:12:49,300 --> 00:12:51,759 installed in France for 332 00:12:51,760 --> 00:12:53,649 the war in Algeria. 333 00:12:56,290 --> 00:12:58,389 It gives exceptional powers 334 00:12:58,390 --> 00:13:00,579 to the minister of interior and 335 00:13:00,580 --> 00:13:03,729 the minister of defense and 336 00:13:03,730 --> 00:13:05,979 as it was shaped as a regime for war 337 00:13:05,980 --> 00:13:07,269 situations. 338 00:13:07,270 --> 00:13:09,369 Now it looks like it's getting less 339 00:13:09,370 --> 00:13:11,619 of exceptional, but there 340 00:13:11,620 --> 00:13:12,699 is more. 341 00:13:12,700 --> 00:13:14,739 This means that we are going to have to 342 00:13:14,740 --> 00:13:17,079 elect our next president in France 343 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:19,539 under an exceptional state of power. 344 00:13:19,540 --> 00:13:21,669 It means that emergency is going 345 00:13:21,670 --> 00:13:23,979 is becoming the current state of affairs. 346 00:13:23,980 --> 00:13:25,179 It's not a bug. 347 00:13:25,180 --> 00:13:26,180 It's a future. 348 00:13:27,670 --> 00:13:29,799 So next, consequences 349 00:13:29,800 --> 00:13:31,419 searches. 350 00:13:31,420 --> 00:13:32,919 This is part of the police 351 00:13:33,940 --> 00:13:36,159 powers, but it has very interesting 352 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,439 things. After the declaration of state 353 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:41,019 of emergency in November 2015, 354 00:13:41,020 --> 00:13:43,419 the police carried a very large number 355 00:13:43,420 --> 00:13:45,699 of house searches at any time 356 00:13:45,700 --> 00:13:48,100 of the day and any time of the night. 357 00:13:49,810 --> 00:13:51,819 And also, considering that it was those 358 00:13:51,820 --> 00:13:53,049 searches were done at the police 359 00:13:53,050 --> 00:13:55,929 discretion without any 360 00:13:55,930 --> 00:13:58,449 control in how the search was carried. 361 00:13:58,450 --> 00:14:00,729 Speaking of numbers, after three 362 00:14:00,730 --> 00:14:03,009 months, there has been around 363 00:14:03,010 --> 00:14:05,529 three thousand three hundred and thirty 364 00:14:05,530 --> 00:14:07,089 six searches. 365 00:14:07,090 --> 00:14:08,919 The searches were not only on the things 366 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:10,899 in the police, but as well on the content 367 00:14:10,900 --> 00:14:13,809 of the computers or the type of system. 368 00:14:13,810 --> 00:14:15,939 There has been various version 369 00:14:15,940 --> 00:14:17,559 of the law that allows those type of 370 00:14:17,560 --> 00:14:19,719 searches. The first law adopted 371 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:21,939 in November allowed 372 00:14:21,940 --> 00:14:24,189 the police to to grab any 373 00:14:24,190 --> 00:14:26,619 type of data on your computer 374 00:14:26,620 --> 00:14:28,779 and any type of system connected 375 00:14:28,780 --> 00:14:30,939 to that computer that in that could 376 00:14:30,940 --> 00:14:32,799 be a remote system, considering it could 377 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:34,869 be your cloud storage, your remote 378 00:14:34,870 --> 00:14:36,249 servers or. 379 00:14:36,250 --> 00:14:37,890 Well, the whole Internet 380 00:14:39,010 --> 00:14:40,149 after that, the 381 00:14:41,590 --> 00:14:43,809 the Constitutional Council, 382 00:14:43,810 --> 00:14:46,209 which is censored 383 00:14:46,210 --> 00:14:48,609 part of the law and 384 00:14:48,610 --> 00:14:50,799 well put some kind of Surgut. 385 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:53,439 But again, when the law was put back in 386 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:55,719 after the attack in Neith on best 387 00:14:55,720 --> 00:14:56,859 day this 388 00:14:57,940 --> 00:15:00,039 day, the extent and the 389 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:02,379 scope of gathering the data on 390 00:15:02,380 --> 00:15:03,940 the computer was once again 391 00:15:05,260 --> 00:15:06,399 broadened. 392 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,099 And that allowed to, for example, 393 00:15:09,100 --> 00:15:11,469 take it, keep and to retain 394 00:15:11,470 --> 00:15:13,659 any type of data that is considered 395 00:15:13,660 --> 00:15:14,949 as suspicious. 396 00:15:14,950 --> 00:15:16,330 But wasn't 397 00:15:17,390 --> 00:15:19,779 it wasn't linked to any type of offense. 398 00:15:19,780 --> 00:15:22,359 And that has been censored again 399 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:24,490 by the council end the past month. 400 00:15:26,800 --> 00:15:28,899 Yeah. So, uh, 401 00:15:28,900 --> 00:15:31,029 next, talk about 402 00:15:31,030 --> 00:15:33,459 the House arrests and limitation 403 00:15:33,460 --> 00:15:35,769 of demonstrations as well. 404 00:15:35,770 --> 00:15:38,859 So along with house searches, 405 00:15:38,860 --> 00:15:41,259 many people were under 406 00:15:41,260 --> 00:15:43,209 house arrest. 407 00:15:43,210 --> 00:15:45,189 This measure was largely used during the 408 00:15:45,190 --> 00:15:47,259 COP 21, which was the conference 409 00:15:47,260 --> 00:15:48,610 on climate change that 410 00:15:49,930 --> 00:15:52,029 was held in Paris 411 00:15:52,030 --> 00:15:53,769 in December 2015 412 00:15:55,420 --> 00:15:57,399 to forbid the organization of 413 00:15:57,400 --> 00:15:58,419 demonstrations. 414 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:01,809 So protesters were receiving notice 415 00:16:01,810 --> 00:16:03,939 that they were not allowed to be 416 00:16:03,940 --> 00:16:06,909 present in certain areas of Paris 417 00:16:06,910 --> 00:16:08,499 during a certain time. 418 00:16:08,500 --> 00:16:10,989 And some of them received 419 00:16:10,990 --> 00:16:14,109 three months or more house arrest, 420 00:16:14,110 --> 00:16:14,989 basically. 421 00:16:14,990 --> 00:16:17,649 Yeah, basically what a house arrest is, 422 00:16:17,650 --> 00:16:20,079 is that you have to be at your place 423 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:22,809 during or at your home during 424 00:16:22,810 --> 00:16:24,459 almost all the day because you have to go 425 00:16:24,460 --> 00:16:26,499 to the police station three times a day 426 00:16:26,500 --> 00:16:28,029 to say that you're here. 427 00:16:28,030 --> 00:16:29,739 So, for example, you have to go on nine 428 00:16:29,740 --> 00:16:32,379 o'clock, one PM and 429 00:16:32,380 --> 00:16:34,629 6:00 PM so you can a very good 430 00:16:34,630 --> 00:16:35,079 walk. 431 00:16:35,080 --> 00:16:36,009 You cannot go anywhere. 432 00:16:36,010 --> 00:16:38,409 You have to stay in the same area. 433 00:16:38,410 --> 00:16:40,749 And then on the top of that, 434 00:16:40,750 --> 00:16:42,699 there are a lot of people from the Muslim 435 00:16:42,700 --> 00:16:44,199 community that have been targeted by the 436 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,299 police. And I haven't seen the house 437 00:16:46,300 --> 00:16:48,429 brutally search along with a notice 438 00:16:48,430 --> 00:16:50,889 of three or more months 439 00:16:50,890 --> 00:16:53,499 without any proven 440 00:16:53,500 --> 00:16:55,809 or non offenses on the sole 441 00:16:55,810 --> 00:16:57,879 fact that there were Muslim and they 442 00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:00,459 might have been maybe 443 00:17:00,460 --> 00:17:02,589 in contact potentially with someone that 444 00:17:02,590 --> 00:17:04,088 has been in contact, that someone has 445 00:17:04,089 --> 00:17:05,529 been in contact, that someone has been in 446 00:17:05,530 --> 00:17:07,149 contact with something. 447 00:17:08,270 --> 00:17:10,459 Yeah, and on the top of 448 00:17:10,460 --> 00:17:12,529 all those measures that are 449 00:17:12,530 --> 00:17:14,868 barely legitimate, France 450 00:17:14,869 --> 00:17:17,088 requested derogations 451 00:17:17,089 --> 00:17:18,979 from the European Court of Human Rights. 452 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,549 It means that France deliberately asked 453 00:17:23,569 --> 00:17:27,019 the permission to infringe human rights. 454 00:17:27,020 --> 00:17:29,479 The Article 15 allows 455 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:31,279 for country to ask for that kind of 456 00:17:31,280 --> 00:17:33,529 permission in case of war 457 00:17:33,530 --> 00:17:35,779 or great danger for the nation. 458 00:17:35,780 --> 00:17:38,059 But what we thought is that 459 00:17:38,060 --> 00:17:40,279 we have seen during the 460 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:42,469 the COP 21 and the heavy 461 00:17:42,470 --> 00:17:44,809 repression of some of the protest 462 00:17:44,810 --> 00:17:47,779 against the labor bill in spring 2006 463 00:17:47,780 --> 00:17:49,999 in the state 464 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:50,929 of emergency. 465 00:17:50,930 --> 00:17:53,390 And the limitation and the derogations 466 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:58,069 are not only used for anti-terrorism 467 00:17:58,070 --> 00:18:00,439 purposes and not only for great 468 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:02,899 danger for the nation's French 469 00:18:02,900 --> 00:18:04,699 Fifth Republic, it's often called a 470 00:18:04,700 --> 00:18:06,439 presidential republic. 471 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,179 This tendency is only confirmed by the 472 00:18:08,180 --> 00:18:10,219 adoption of the recent laws led to a real 473 00:18:10,220 --> 00:18:12,709 shift, strengthening the executive 474 00:18:12,710 --> 00:18:14,480 power at the expense of 475 00:18:16,150 --> 00:18:18,069 the legislative and judicial authority. 476 00:18:19,820 --> 00:18:22,189 Let's remember that the separation 477 00:18:22,190 --> 00:18:24,379 of powers is a key principle 478 00:18:24,380 --> 00:18:26,719 for a democracy, as none of the part 479 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:28,849 of the poor are perfect and an all 480 00:18:28,850 --> 00:18:31,159 need to be balance by each other, 481 00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:33,319 which is written in 482 00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:35,269 the declaration of human and civic pride 483 00:18:35,270 --> 00:18:37,210 since 1789. 484 00:18:39,530 --> 00:18:41,659 A society in which the observance of the 485 00:18:41,660 --> 00:18:44,029 law is not assured nor the separation 486 00:18:44,030 --> 00:18:46,129 of powers defined has no constitution at 487 00:18:46,130 --> 00:18:46,579 all. 488 00:18:46,580 --> 00:18:48,649 So maybe we could say 489 00:18:48,650 --> 00:18:50,749 or ask whether France as 490 00:18:50,750 --> 00:18:53,149 a constitutional at all competition. 491 00:18:53,150 --> 00:18:54,150 Yeah, 492 00:18:55,910 --> 00:18:57,649 that was a slide from the previous 493 00:18:57,650 --> 00:18:59,809 version of this presentation and 494 00:18:59,810 --> 00:19:01,519 the catalog of all the laws we've been 495 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:03,439 telling you about so far. 496 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:05,209 It goes from 2013. 497 00:19:05,210 --> 00:19:07,369 We decided to start on 2013 498 00:19:07,370 --> 00:19:08,989 because otherwise it would have been a 499 00:19:08,990 --> 00:19:10,789 six hour presentation. 500 00:19:11,930 --> 00:19:13,669 But from the military planning law to the 501 00:19:13,670 --> 00:19:15,199 terror of the law surveillance law, you 502 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:17,359 have been heard about 503 00:19:17,360 --> 00:19:19,609 those low in the prior in the Treaty 504 00:19:19,610 --> 00:19:21,589 to See treaty have been a presentation on 505 00:19:21,590 --> 00:19:24,169 those laws and after the extension 506 00:19:24,170 --> 00:19:26,509 of the state of emergency 507 00:19:26,510 --> 00:19:28,789 and the reform of the penal law 508 00:19:28,790 --> 00:19:31,279 that that includes 509 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:33,379 now in the common law measure from the 510 00:19:33,380 --> 00:19:34,380 state of emergency, 511 00:19:36,950 --> 00:19:39,259 there's laws are only 512 00:19:39,260 --> 00:19:41,449 those who are related in a way 513 00:19:41,450 --> 00:19:43,069 or another to the digital 514 00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:44,669 issue. 515 00:19:44,670 --> 00:19:47,479 So there are some others on immigration, 516 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,879 on several things 517 00:19:49,880 --> 00:19:50,779 on the phone. 518 00:19:50,780 --> 00:19:52,709 At some point we were wondering if they 519 00:19:52,710 --> 00:19:54,829 were all trying to put terrorism in 520 00:19:54,830 --> 00:19:57,169 a law so they could go further. 521 00:19:57,170 --> 00:19:59,239 For example, I remember a law that was 522 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,389 called a law on transportation, 523 00:20:02,390 --> 00:20:04,760 public transport and terrorism. 524 00:20:06,410 --> 00:20:08,629 So I had someone we all like, hey, 525 00:20:08,630 --> 00:20:10,159 do you want a sandwich? Yeah, I would 526 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:12,079 like him. Cheese and terrorism. 527 00:20:15,830 --> 00:20:18,919 So let's talk about privacy now. 528 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:20,149 Are you kidding? Have you thought of 529 00:20:20,150 --> 00:20:21,499 terrorist? 530 00:20:21,500 --> 00:20:23,239 This is a great illustration. 531 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:24,619 Yeah. 532 00:20:24,620 --> 00:20:25,819 So why privacy? 533 00:20:27,350 --> 00:20:29,449 Because it's increasingly something 534 00:20:29,450 --> 00:20:31,909 attacked in all laws, as 535 00:20:31,910 --> 00:20:34,459 in France, in France, as something 536 00:20:34,460 --> 00:20:36,769 to limit or bypass 537 00:20:36,770 --> 00:20:38,540 in order to fight against terrorism, 538 00:20:39,830 --> 00:20:42,619 more especially to protect people 539 00:20:42,620 --> 00:20:45,439 from themselves or from the others, 540 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:47,480 but normal people. 541 00:20:49,370 --> 00:20:51,589 So, yeah, but as soon 542 00:20:51,590 --> 00:20:54,559 as you weaken fundamental rights, you 543 00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:55,560 have lost my name. 544 00:20:57,230 --> 00:20:59,299 As soon as you weaken fundamental 545 00:20:59,300 --> 00:21:01,459 rights, we we can all order rights. 546 00:21:01,460 --> 00:21:03,199 The state of emergency regime is a 547 00:21:03,200 --> 00:21:05,749 perfect example of how the weakening 548 00:21:05,750 --> 00:21:07,909 of our rights and our liberties affect 549 00:21:07,910 --> 00:21:09,259 our societies. 550 00:21:09,260 --> 00:21:10,789 But privacy is a condition for us to 551 00:21:10,790 --> 00:21:13,339 exist and to think and to be ourselves 552 00:21:14,390 --> 00:21:15,499 how to be free. 553 00:21:15,500 --> 00:21:17,659 If you don't know whether you thought our 554 00:21:17,660 --> 00:21:20,419 kind by public or private actors, 555 00:21:20,420 --> 00:21:22,489 the Panopticon site is being installed 556 00:21:22,490 --> 00:21:24,979 in a very insidious way, a sense 557 00:21:24,980 --> 00:21:27,289 of self-censorship is going along 558 00:21:27,290 --> 00:21:28,290 with it. 559 00:21:29,910 --> 00:21:32,159 But there is more in a society 560 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:34,349 where Panopticon is the norm, 561 00:21:34,350 --> 00:21:36,599 the only way to exert our liberties 562 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:39,329 and to have some privacy and encryption, 563 00:21:39,330 --> 00:21:41,489 as you know, encryption is one of the key 564 00:21:41,490 --> 00:21:43,989 battle for the next two years. 565 00:21:43,990 --> 00:21:46,379 And unfortunately, 566 00:21:46,380 --> 00:21:48,539 our politicians have not up to the 567 00:21:48,540 --> 00:21:50,819 issue and are trying to weaken or harm 568 00:21:50,820 --> 00:21:52,889 encryption, especially between 569 00:21:52,890 --> 00:21:55,109 friends with Paul in that time. 570 00:21:55,110 --> 00:21:57,219 And so up trust 571 00:21:57,220 --> 00:21:59,369 work for what we want and 572 00:21:59,370 --> 00:22:01,619 what we believe in. 573 00:22:01,620 --> 00:22:03,599 So, no, explain the situation. 574 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:06,569 Let's go to what we can do. 575 00:22:06,570 --> 00:22:09,449 So I really like this this quotation 576 00:22:09,450 --> 00:22:11,549 that says A be the change you want to see 577 00:22:11,550 --> 00:22:14,219 in the war against 578 00:22:14,220 --> 00:22:16,409 al Qaeda in the quadrature tries 579 00:22:16,410 --> 00:22:19,049 to do this in a very different way. 580 00:22:19,050 --> 00:22:20,759 First of all, there is one of the big 581 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:22,769 works is advocacy. 582 00:22:22,770 --> 00:22:25,109 We did a lot of advocacy work 583 00:22:25,110 --> 00:22:27,509 on all those little mentioned before, 584 00:22:27,510 --> 00:22:30,119 but as friends, since 585 00:22:30,120 --> 00:22:32,219 while the few month I started 586 00:22:32,220 --> 00:22:34,319 an electoral electoral year 587 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,539 and as we know that politics are more 588 00:22:36,540 --> 00:22:38,399 communication than actual work, 589 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,619 especially when an election is coming, 590 00:22:40,620 --> 00:22:43,139 it becomes almost impossible to follow 591 00:22:43,140 --> 00:22:44,969 in to explain the disaster to the member 592 00:22:44,970 --> 00:22:47,369 of parliament or to the government 593 00:22:47,370 --> 00:22:48,749 that just reply they have the 594 00:22:48,750 --> 00:22:50,609 responsibility to fight terrorism and so 595 00:22:50,610 --> 00:22:52,439 on and so on. And there is, of course, no 596 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:53,440 other way to do this. 597 00:22:54,570 --> 00:22:56,099 When advocates it's not efficient 598 00:22:56,100 --> 00:22:57,089 anymore. 599 00:22:57,090 --> 00:22:59,309 We try to switch our strategy 600 00:22:59,310 --> 00:23:02,369 and, for example, document the future 601 00:23:02,370 --> 00:23:03,929 for the future. 602 00:23:03,930 --> 00:23:06,419 So, for example, this is in French, but 603 00:23:06,420 --> 00:23:08,879 this is one of the document we 604 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:11,009 write to try to explain how 605 00:23:11,010 --> 00:23:13,829 the whole system of security 606 00:23:13,830 --> 00:23:15,539 is going on. 607 00:23:15,540 --> 00:23:17,309 It's called the Boulevard of the End of 608 00:23:17,310 --> 00:23:18,209 Liberties. 609 00:23:18,210 --> 00:23:20,249 We like very dramatic titles are we are 610 00:23:20,250 --> 00:23:21,250 French. 611 00:23:22,500 --> 00:23:25,109 It goes from 2004 14 612 00:23:25,110 --> 00:23:27,749 to 2016. Basically, it's everything 613 00:23:27,750 --> 00:23:28,750 you've seen until the 614 00:23:29,910 --> 00:23:31,829 penal law reform. 615 00:23:31,830 --> 00:23:33,449 You can find it on our wiki. 616 00:23:33,450 --> 00:23:35,909 If you were interesting to translate this 617 00:23:35,910 --> 00:23:38,459 to us, that would be a fine idea. 618 00:23:38,460 --> 00:23:40,619 And furthermore, after that, in May 619 00:23:40,620 --> 00:23:42,989 2016, we 620 00:23:42,990 --> 00:23:44,909 really switch strategies. 621 00:23:44,910 --> 00:23:47,219 We decided to leave the state 622 00:23:47,220 --> 00:23:48,220 of emergency. 623 00:23:49,350 --> 00:23:51,629 Explain, for example, why 624 00:23:51,630 --> 00:23:54,419 we understood that the fact that 625 00:23:54,420 --> 00:23:55,739 politicians were going on for 626 00:23:55,740 --> 00:23:57,779 communication and maybe to be elected, it 627 00:23:57,780 --> 00:23:59,849 was very hard to try to for them to 628 00:23:59,850 --> 00:24:00,850 listen to us. 629 00:24:02,460 --> 00:24:04,619 So right now, what we're liquidating is 630 00:24:04,620 --> 00:24:06,419 working, mostly working on a positive 631 00:24:06,420 --> 00:24:08,519 proposal and to increase or work 632 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:10,979 towards the general public in order to 633 00:24:10,980 --> 00:24:12,959 to understand the major issues. 634 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:15,119 Basically, we just took 635 00:24:15,120 --> 00:24:17,249 a tactical step back so we can 636 00:24:17,250 --> 00:24:19,709 go again more in the future. 637 00:24:19,710 --> 00:24:21,539 Please read the whole press release. 638 00:24:21,540 --> 00:24:23,400 The euro is here. 639 00:24:27,900 --> 00:24:29,879 Well, that's only for France. 640 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:31,799 We keep working at the European level on 641 00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:32,939 the same thing. 642 00:24:32,940 --> 00:24:35,039 And for example, also but we don't 643 00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:37,469 disappear from the political landscape 644 00:24:37,470 --> 00:24:39,989 as we join other likeminded NGO 645 00:24:39,990 --> 00:24:42,539 to create a common platform to promote 646 00:24:42,540 --> 00:24:44,669 our proposals during the 647 00:24:44,670 --> 00:24:46,199 general election debate. 648 00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:48,209 But we don't really aiming them any type 649 00:24:48,210 --> 00:24:49,769 of candidate. We're just saying that's 650 00:24:49,770 --> 00:24:50,770 the world we want. 651 00:24:53,300 --> 00:24:54,300 So 652 00:24:57,500 --> 00:24:59,419 to hack our way around the limit of 653 00:24:59,420 --> 00:25:01,729 advocacy, for two years, 654 00:25:01,730 --> 00:25:03,739 we've been filing court case against 655 00:25:03,740 --> 00:25:04,740 those close. 656 00:25:07,130 --> 00:25:09,429 This is a joint effort with made with 657 00:25:09,430 --> 00:25:11,839 two other NGOs, 658 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:14,329 the two of them are the DNA 659 00:25:14,330 --> 00:25:16,909 evidence. So of FBN 660 00:25:16,910 --> 00:25:18,559 is a nonprofit. 661 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,229 The first one is a nonprofit ISP, 662 00:25:21,230 --> 00:25:23,659 the France Funds Holders Internet 663 00:25:23,660 --> 00:25:26,899 access provider since 1992. 664 00:25:26,900 --> 00:25:29,299 And FDN is 665 00:25:29,300 --> 00:25:31,369 a federation of nonprofit 666 00:25:31,370 --> 00:25:32,329 ISP. 667 00:25:32,330 --> 00:25:34,549 So gathering around 30 user 668 00:25:34,550 --> 00:25:36,619 ported non-profits, Internet access 669 00:25:36,620 --> 00:25:38,869 providers, including Abberton. 670 00:25:38,870 --> 00:25:41,209 And there is also one in Belgium, 671 00:25:41,210 --> 00:25:43,369 for example, not only in France. 672 00:25:44,930 --> 00:25:47,239 So this is 673 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:49,849 the nickname of the group is 674 00:25:49,850 --> 00:25:52,279 the exegete amateur. 675 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,249 So with a great translation in English, 676 00:25:55,250 --> 00:25:57,619 um, it's a group 677 00:25:57,620 --> 00:25:59,959 of volunteering lawyers and gigs 678 00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:02,209 in France using the system 679 00:26:02,210 --> 00:26:04,460 to fight the system and 680 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:07,759 sometimes to lose against the system. 681 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,429 And we try to win also 682 00:26:10,430 --> 00:26:11,419 sometimes. 683 00:26:11,420 --> 00:26:13,549 So the red team is 684 00:26:13,550 --> 00:26:16,039 actually an informal 685 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,199 and self organized 686 00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:20,599 working group. So no, not a really 687 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:22,510 NGO registered in France. 688 00:26:23,570 --> 00:26:24,570 They started 689 00:26:25,850 --> 00:26:28,849 the first lawsuits in early 2015 690 00:26:29,930 --> 00:26:32,659 on data retention 691 00:26:32,660 --> 00:26:34,999 and then on state sponsorship 692 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,009 and surveillance. 693 00:26:37,010 --> 00:26:39,169 And for two years 694 00:26:39,170 --> 00:26:42,289 they've launched twenty procedures, 695 00:26:42,290 --> 00:26:44,539 which is huge now, knowing that they're 696 00:26:44,540 --> 00:26:46,729 all volunteers. I mean, they all are 697 00:26:46,730 --> 00:26:49,069 working their 698 00:26:49,070 --> 00:26:50,809 normal work during the day and they're 699 00:26:50,810 --> 00:26:52,939 working for the kids during 700 00:26:52,940 --> 00:26:54,919 the evening, the night that we can then 701 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,109 sometimes during that time probably as 702 00:26:57,110 --> 00:26:58,110 well. 703 00:26:58,590 --> 00:26:59,989 But don't tell that to their employer. 704 00:26:59,990 --> 00:27:00,990 Yeah. 705 00:27:01,460 --> 00:27:03,619 Uh, we will 706 00:27:03,620 --> 00:27:05,240 I will give a quick overview 707 00:27:06,500 --> 00:27:08,629 of of of their child, but I will try 708 00:27:08,630 --> 00:27:10,639 to make it simple because I'm not going 709 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:12,859 to detail twenty procedures which are 710 00:27:12,860 --> 00:27:14,059 not possible. 711 00:27:14,060 --> 00:27:16,669 And if you're interested 712 00:27:16,670 --> 00:27:18,769 in it and there will be a central 713 00:27:18,770 --> 00:27:20,389 organization, but we will give the 714 00:27:20,390 --> 00:27:22,129 information at 4:00 p.m. 715 00:27:22,130 --> 00:27:23,130 today 716 00:27:24,470 --> 00:27:25,910 with some of the exegete 717 00:27:27,350 --> 00:27:29,539 to talk about our 718 00:27:29,540 --> 00:27:31,639 litigation case, give more information 719 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:33,709 and also to coordinate litigation teams 720 00:27:33,710 --> 00:27:35,689 in Europe if some of you are involved in 721 00:27:35,690 --> 00:27:37,789 such groups, 722 00:27:37,790 --> 00:27:40,009 because this is quite important and we've 723 00:27:40,010 --> 00:27:42,979 already tried to start it, but 724 00:27:42,980 --> 00:27:45,109 we feel that it would be great to 725 00:27:45,110 --> 00:27:47,329 to go more into 726 00:27:47,330 --> 00:27:48,379 it. 727 00:27:48,380 --> 00:27:50,479 So first, on 728 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:52,759 data retention and access, 729 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:55,399 the French military planning, a law 730 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,429 that was adopted in December 2013, 731 00:27:58,430 --> 00:28:00,859 extended the way for the administrative 732 00:28:00,860 --> 00:28:02,960 bodies to get access to metadata, 733 00:28:04,120 --> 00:28:06,259 uh, written by hosting 734 00:28:06,260 --> 00:28:08,689 providers and ISP within a large 735 00:28:08,690 --> 00:28:10,789 and imprecise in precise scope for the 736 00:28:10,790 --> 00:28:12,289 defense and promotion of national 737 00:28:12,290 --> 00:28:14,569 interests, which is so very 738 00:28:14,570 --> 00:28:15,570 broad. 739 00:28:17,390 --> 00:28:19,459 In fact, we started to 740 00:28:19,460 --> 00:28:21,709 court cases for this one, one more 741 00:28:21,710 --> 00:28:23,839 focused on data retention and that 742 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,239 access in the framework of this specific 743 00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:28,549 military planning law and 744 00:28:28,550 --> 00:28:30,919 one another on the whole existing 745 00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:32,690 framework for data retention. 746 00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:36,889 And one of our main argument 747 00:28:36,890 --> 00:28:39,379 were that in 2014, 748 00:28:39,380 --> 00:28:41,779 the European Court of Justice 749 00:28:41,780 --> 00:28:43,849 had overturned the 750 00:28:43,850 --> 00:28:46,339 EU data retention provisions adopted 751 00:28:46,340 --> 00:28:47,629 in 2016. 752 00:28:47,630 --> 00:28:49,699 So one year, 10 years 753 00:28:49,700 --> 00:28:51,979 ago in a ruling called Digital 754 00:28:51,980 --> 00:28:54,439 Rights Ireland. So maybe some of you 755 00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:56,209 already heard about it. 756 00:28:56,210 --> 00:28:58,669 For the first court case focused 757 00:28:58,670 --> 00:29:00,979 on military planning, a law 758 00:29:00,980 --> 00:29:03,199 was rejected by the Court of states 759 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,599 of up by the conceded that the 760 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,359 Supreme Administrative 761 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:09,360 Court. 762 00:29:10,370 --> 00:29:12,439 We had asked for a preliminary 763 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,869 ruling to 764 00:29:14,870 --> 00:29:16,969 say that the preliminary ruling is 765 00:29:16,970 --> 00:29:20,179 a question asked by a national judge 766 00:29:20,180 --> 00:29:22,519 to the European 767 00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:25,459 Court of Justice for interpreting 768 00:29:25,460 --> 00:29:28,579 for well, we ask them to interpret 769 00:29:28,580 --> 00:29:31,819 the European those regulations, 770 00:29:31,820 --> 00:29:34,010 the European ruling, and 771 00:29:36,110 --> 00:29:38,899 it enables a more 772 00:29:38,900 --> 00:29:41,119 a better harmonized 773 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,459 implementation of the regulation, 774 00:29:43,460 --> 00:29:45,049 the European regulation in all the member 775 00:29:45,050 --> 00:29:46,050 states. 776 00:29:46,790 --> 00:29:49,729 Unfortunately, the court say that 777 00:29:49,730 --> 00:29:51,829 our court did not 778 00:29:51,830 --> 00:29:53,659 even explain why they did not ask for the 779 00:29:53,660 --> 00:29:55,219 question, but they didn't ask for the 780 00:29:55,220 --> 00:29:56,179 question. 781 00:29:56,180 --> 00:29:59,299 And fortunately, 782 00:29:59,300 --> 00:30:01,279 the good news is that although national 783 00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:03,409 courts such as the Swedish one and the 784 00:30:03,410 --> 00:30:04,410 British one. 785 00:30:06,100 --> 00:30:07,989 Are making it better than French ones, 786 00:30:07,990 --> 00:30:10,149 and I've had 787 00:30:10,150 --> 00:30:12,039 asked exactly the same question to the 788 00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:13,809 European Court of Justice and that our 789 00:30:13,810 --> 00:30:15,999 attention and the 790 00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:17,559 European Court of Justice replied last 791 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:19,569 week on 21st of December, I think it 792 00:30:19,570 --> 00:30:22,089 would last week or the week before that 793 00:30:23,140 --> 00:30:25,719 a general and indiscriminate data 794 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,789 retention of thought 795 00:30:27,790 --> 00:30:29,979 this year ago, both of all 796 00:30:29,980 --> 00:30:31,959 traffic and location data of all 797 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:34,659 subscribers and registered users 798 00:30:34,660 --> 00:30:36,519 relating to all the means of electronic 799 00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:39,009 communication was not compatible 800 00:30:39,010 --> 00:30:40,599 with the EU Charter of Fundamental 801 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,789 Rights. So that was what we were saying 802 00:30:42,790 --> 00:30:44,869 and that was what 803 00:30:44,870 --> 00:30:46,299 the can say that I said 804 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:49,479 you're wrong or and we didn't. 805 00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:50,769 We want to explain to you why you're 806 00:30:50,770 --> 00:30:53,119 wrong or we will explain you 807 00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:54,120 badly. 808 00:30:56,530 --> 00:30:58,569 So this ruling is a very good news for 809 00:30:58,570 --> 00:30:59,570 us. 810 00:31:00,040 --> 00:31:02,139 We were kicked out by the 811 00:31:02,140 --> 00:31:03,819 competitor and the European Court of 812 00:31:03,820 --> 00:31:05,290 Justice just said we were right. 813 00:31:07,750 --> 00:31:09,869 Now, we hope that they can say that 814 00:31:09,870 --> 00:31:11,499 they will take it into account for our 815 00:31:11,500 --> 00:31:13,629 second court case, the 816 00:31:13,630 --> 00:31:15,729 one of the four, the more 817 00:31:15,730 --> 00:31:17,829 general framework of data retention in 818 00:31:17,830 --> 00:31:19,059 France. 819 00:31:19,060 --> 00:31:21,099 So we are impatient to know 820 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:23,739 to see what will come out from this 821 00:31:23,740 --> 00:31:26,109 decision as the stakes 822 00:31:26,110 --> 00:31:27,110 are very high. 823 00:31:28,870 --> 00:31:31,209 Um, next part. 824 00:31:31,210 --> 00:31:33,759 Yeah, next part on civilians slow. 825 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,099 So it started a long time ago when 826 00:31:36,100 --> 00:31:38,449 probably some of you weren't born yet. 827 00:31:38,450 --> 00:31:39,579 Well, yeah. 828 00:31:39,580 --> 00:31:41,190 In 1991, 829 00:31:43,510 --> 00:31:45,579 after a ruling by the European Court 830 00:31:45,580 --> 00:31:48,099 of Human Rights that France 831 00:31:48,100 --> 00:31:49,790 was violating privacy rights. 832 00:31:51,070 --> 00:31:52,809 The French government enacted 833 00:31:55,060 --> 00:31:57,849 so on already on 1991, 834 00:31:57,850 --> 00:32:00,999 France was doing things 835 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,089 for infringing human rights. 836 00:32:04,090 --> 00:32:06,699 So it's probably not very new. 837 00:32:06,700 --> 00:32:07,700 But 838 00:32:08,800 --> 00:32:11,979 so French government enacted 839 00:32:11,980 --> 00:32:14,079 a law on surveillance to enable 840 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:16,539 public authority to use surveillance 841 00:32:16,540 --> 00:32:19,269 techniques and control 842 00:32:19,270 --> 00:32:21,639 radio communication 843 00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:23,709 without any oversight of 844 00:32:23,710 --> 00:32:25,959 any independent entity for 845 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:27,969 the defense of national interests. 846 00:32:27,970 --> 00:32:30,279 National interests are always the most 847 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,349 important. So we can do whatever we 848 00:32:32,350 --> 00:32:34,479 want and use whatever technique 849 00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:36,729 to control and to 850 00:32:36,730 --> 00:32:38,889 monitor radio 851 00:32:38,890 --> 00:32:40,779 communications. 852 00:32:40,780 --> 00:32:42,849 So we challenge these provisions before 853 00:32:42,850 --> 00:32:45,879 the constitutional, the coup, the 854 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:48,429 constitutional, which is the 855 00:32:48,430 --> 00:32:51,279 constitutional court, 856 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:53,379 and succeeded in October, striking 857 00:32:53,380 --> 00:32:55,209 down the legal regime for the 858 00:32:55,210 --> 00:32:57,559 surveillance of radio transmissions. 859 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,389 So now they cannot 860 00:33:01,390 --> 00:33:03,779 do like they look like before and 861 00:33:03,780 --> 00:33:06,009 and make surveillance of radio 862 00:33:06,010 --> 00:33:08,259 transmission without any oversight, which 863 00:33:08,260 --> 00:33:10,060 was what they did before. 864 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:13,659 Unfortunately, that's not all on 865 00:33:13,660 --> 00:33:15,879 surveillance. So we saw earlier that 866 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:17,679 since the adoption of the surveillance 867 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:21,069 law in July 2015, 868 00:33:21,070 --> 00:33:23,829 the tools for intelligence services 869 00:33:23,830 --> 00:33:25,779 and other public bodies have been 870 00:33:25,780 --> 00:33:26,739 developed. 871 00:33:26,740 --> 00:33:28,989 So the scope broadened 872 00:33:28,990 --> 00:33:30,789 the oversight not strong enough, 873 00:33:32,170 --> 00:33:34,269 but at the same time the judicial 874 00:33:34,270 --> 00:33:37,479 remedy has not been enhanced. 875 00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,609 And we have challenged all the 876 00:33:39,610 --> 00:33:42,159 implementing decrees, five of them, 877 00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:44,079 and we are still ongoing proceeding 878 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:45,899 against the French government and the 879 00:33:45,900 --> 00:33:48,309 conceded that. So it's still ongoing. 880 00:33:48,310 --> 00:33:49,839 We're still waiting for the, 881 00:33:51,310 --> 00:33:53,379 uh. I mean, no, 882 00:33:53,380 --> 00:33:55,449 we just you know, we 883 00:33:55,450 --> 00:33:56,450 we sent 884 00:33:57,970 --> 00:34:00,249 information to the court and 885 00:34:00,250 --> 00:34:01,929 the government replied and then we can 886 00:34:01,930 --> 00:34:04,509 reply and so and so on until 887 00:34:04,510 --> 00:34:05,919 there is a decision. 888 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:07,779 So it's still ongoing. 889 00:34:08,949 --> 00:34:11,859 So. And on censorship, 890 00:34:11,860 --> 00:34:14,499 which is the third big 891 00:34:14,500 --> 00:34:17,169 focus of the excisions. 892 00:34:17,170 --> 00:34:18,909 So the terrorism law 893 00:34:20,260 --> 00:34:22,658 adopted in 2014 894 00:34:22,659 --> 00:34:25,388 enables administrative body to block 895 00:34:25,389 --> 00:34:27,549 websites without prior 896 00:34:27,550 --> 00:34:28,960 judicial oversight, 897 00:34:30,190 --> 00:34:32,349 without prior judicial redress and 898 00:34:32,350 --> 00:34:34,178 without further inefficiency. 899 00:34:34,179 --> 00:34:37,029 So real censorship. 900 00:34:38,350 --> 00:34:40,579 So France, France 901 00:34:40,580 --> 00:34:42,339 got rid of him is even worse than 902 00:34:42,340 --> 00:34:45,189 Russia's website working legislation 903 00:34:45,190 --> 00:34:47,259 because in Russia, the 904 00:34:47,260 --> 00:34:49,178 blacklist is actually subject to public 905 00:34:49,179 --> 00:34:50,179 scrutiny. 906 00:34:51,230 --> 00:34:53,779 In France, the list is updated in secret 907 00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:57,319 by the French police, and 908 00:34:57,320 --> 00:34:59,119 we cannot access it. 909 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,179 Apparently the only country in Europe 910 00:35:02,180 --> 00:35:04,369 doing as bad as France is Turkey. 911 00:35:04,370 --> 00:35:05,409 So nice. 912 00:35:12,620 --> 00:35:14,899 Furthermore, when apage 913 00:35:14,900 --> 00:35:15,900 sensate. 914 00:35:16,830 --> 00:35:19,049 Users that try to reach 915 00:35:19,050 --> 00:35:21,209 the page are 916 00:35:21,210 --> 00:35:23,819 automatically redirected, the minister 917 00:35:23,820 --> 00:35:26,429 of interior webpage, 918 00:35:26,430 --> 00:35:27,430 website. 919 00:35:29,970 --> 00:35:32,249 And when we challenged this, 920 00:35:32,250 --> 00:35:34,619 they can say that dismissed our argument, 921 00:35:34,620 --> 00:35:36,689 saying it was OK because there 922 00:35:36,690 --> 00:35:38,759 were there was no processing of personal 923 00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:41,279 data, such as IP addresses, 924 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:42,259 for example. 925 00:35:42,260 --> 00:35:44,129 Yeah, yeah, sure. 926 00:35:44,130 --> 00:35:45,269 Guess what happened 927 00:35:46,290 --> 00:35:47,309 a few weeks ago 928 00:35:48,660 --> 00:35:51,330 around our historical telecom 929 00:35:52,590 --> 00:35:55,259 operator made a big mistake 930 00:35:55,260 --> 00:35:58,079 and locked IP addresses 931 00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:01,829 of Google, Wikipedia 932 00:36:01,830 --> 00:36:04,259 and other websites. 933 00:36:04,260 --> 00:36:06,479 So big deals already for all 934 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:09,959 those who are using or rent the tennis. 935 00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:12,629 And all the people were redirected 936 00:36:12,630 --> 00:36:14,610 to the Ministry of Intelligence 937 00:36:18,690 --> 00:36:20,249 and had a page. 938 00:36:20,250 --> 00:36:22,379 Well, the page fold down at the end 939 00:36:22,380 --> 00:36:24,479 that they had appeared at the beginning 940 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:26,909 saying that they had tried to reach 941 00:36:26,910 --> 00:36:27,969 terrorist websites. 942 00:36:27,970 --> 00:36:30,179 So Google now 943 00:36:30,180 --> 00:36:32,159 Google had become a terrorist website by 944 00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:33,869 a human mistake, which is quite 945 00:36:33,870 --> 00:36:35,279 interesting. 946 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:37,739 And the ministry 947 00:36:37,740 --> 00:36:39,839 has just announced that the collect 948 00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:42,419 that data collected because of 949 00:36:42,420 --> 00:36:44,429 this mistake wouldn't not be processed. 950 00:36:45,810 --> 00:36:47,879 But he had said before that none or the 951 00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:49,349 that I had said before, that none of the 952 00:36:49,350 --> 00:36:51,389 data were processed. 953 00:36:51,390 --> 00:36:53,519 So what it seem that he's 954 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,739 changed his mind between 955 00:36:55,740 --> 00:36:58,229 before the orange failed and after 956 00:36:58,230 --> 00:37:00,749 the one the orange fell. 957 00:37:00,750 --> 00:37:02,859 So, no, we are getting back to the 958 00:37:02,860 --> 00:37:04,380 that with new evidence again, 959 00:37:05,940 --> 00:37:08,579 so that with with the exegete 960 00:37:08,580 --> 00:37:10,769 and well, there will be 961 00:37:10,770 --> 00:37:13,679 more information and possible possibility 962 00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:14,729 to talk with them 963 00:37:15,870 --> 00:37:17,969 and with us to 964 00:37:17,970 --> 00:37:19,079 be alarmed. 965 00:37:19,080 --> 00:37:21,089 It's on the fourth floor in front of all 966 00:37:21,090 --> 00:37:22,289 one hour. 967 00:37:22,290 --> 00:37:24,719 So it's like the place like huge glasses 968 00:37:24,720 --> 00:37:26,159 and it's like very beautiful. 969 00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:27,179 I think this where you have the 970 00:37:27,180 --> 00:37:29,729 mannequins, maybe it's 971 00:37:29,730 --> 00:37:31,019 in at 4:00 p.m. 972 00:37:31,020 --> 00:37:33,299 at 4:00 p.m. today to fourth floor 973 00:37:33,300 --> 00:37:34,380 to talk with the exhibits. 974 00:37:37,260 --> 00:37:39,359 So there is a sign that 975 00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:41,669 those are all legal challenges 976 00:37:41,670 --> 00:37:43,799 and legal work we're doing, 977 00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:45,839 which is in fact very, very interesting, 978 00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:47,759 because sometimes when you have a huge 979 00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:49,019 website blocked, you have new 980 00:37:49,020 --> 00:37:50,020 information. 981 00:37:50,620 --> 00:37:52,889 One of the other means of Laquidara is to 982 00:37:52,890 --> 00:37:54,989 work with people and to help them 983 00:37:54,990 --> 00:37:57,359 to understand and reappropriate 984 00:37:57,360 --> 00:37:59,849 themself the issues and or 985 00:37:59,850 --> 00:38:00,809 fight. 986 00:38:00,810 --> 00:38:03,029 The idea is so people can not only 987 00:38:03,030 --> 00:38:05,249 be part of it, but to make their fight 988 00:38:05,250 --> 00:38:06,119 their own. 989 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:07,289 So we can decentralize. 990 00:38:07,290 --> 00:38:09,779 We can. We can we are not the provider 991 00:38:09,780 --> 00:38:11,559 of how it should be. 992 00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:14,279 We have, as you know, every 993 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,619 C.C.C., we talk about our tools and 994 00:38:16,620 --> 00:38:19,259 we have a lot of ongoing working tools. 995 00:38:19,260 --> 00:38:21,359 And most of them are working and most of 996 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:22,360 them are really awesome. 997 00:38:23,430 --> 00:38:25,559 So McPaul, which 998 00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:28,169 is a tool that allows us to track 999 00:38:28,170 --> 00:38:30,239 the position of a representative of 1000 00:38:30,240 --> 00:38:32,459 our time on a subject so 1001 00:38:32,460 --> 00:38:34,529 vertically. So you will be able to know 1002 00:38:34,530 --> 00:38:36,719 if your representative what 1003 00:38:36,720 --> 00:38:39,179 what he voted before and after 1004 00:38:39,180 --> 00:38:40,079 this and that and that. 1005 00:38:40,080 --> 00:38:41,819 And you see foreign policy changes his 1006 00:38:41,820 --> 00:38:43,079 mind a lot are not, 1007 00:38:44,100 --> 00:38:46,259 for example, were 1008 00:38:46,260 --> 00:38:48,029 for example, we on our instance of 1009 00:38:48,030 --> 00:38:49,649 memorable because memorable can be 1010 00:38:49,650 --> 00:38:51,239 decentralized and you can install your 1011 00:38:51,240 --> 00:38:52,559 own instance, which is great. 1012 00:38:54,690 --> 00:38:57,209 We have people that voted for ACTA 1013 00:38:57,210 --> 00:38:59,369 back in the days and they voted for the 1014 00:38:59,370 --> 00:39:01,199 surveillance law in France when they come 1015 00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:02,309 back from the European 1016 00:39:03,390 --> 00:39:04,649 administration to different 1017 00:39:04,650 --> 00:39:06,449 administration. So they have such a bad 1018 00:39:06,450 --> 00:39:08,249 score, it's almost impossible, you know, 1019 00:39:08,250 --> 00:39:10,149 that this guy is such a bad dude. 1020 00:39:10,150 --> 00:39:11,150 It was possible. 1021 00:39:12,390 --> 00:39:14,459 Well, there is this is 1022 00:39:14,460 --> 00:39:16,529 a tool that is on free and open source 1023 00:39:16,530 --> 00:39:18,029 software. 1024 00:39:18,030 --> 00:39:20,159 It's on our market. So please check it 1025 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,229 up if you're if you're a developer or if 1026 00:39:22,230 --> 00:39:24,839 you like doing that at work and so on, 1027 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:26,339 it's really, really interesting. 1028 00:39:26,340 --> 00:39:28,439 The next tool that we are 1029 00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:29,939 using is the phone. 1030 00:39:29,940 --> 00:39:31,349 We use it to contact Frehley or 1031 00:39:31,350 --> 00:39:32,459 representative. 1032 00:39:32,460 --> 00:39:34,559 The idea is that people, 1033 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:36,419 when they're on an ongoing European 1034 00:39:36,420 --> 00:39:38,669 campaign, for example, for the 1035 00:39:38,670 --> 00:39:40,589 European Parliament, how they're going to 1036 00:39:40,590 --> 00:39:42,269 be able to contact the representative 1037 00:39:42,270 --> 00:39:44,219 because, well, you know, phone charges. 1038 00:39:44,220 --> 00:39:45,719 And when you have to do international 1039 00:39:45,720 --> 00:39:48,179 phone, it's even more while everyone 1040 00:39:48,180 --> 00:39:49,769 should be able to participate in the 1041 00:39:49,770 --> 00:39:51,959 public debate, that's what that means, 1042 00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:54,209 that you shouldn't be worried about 1043 00:39:54,210 --> 00:39:55,349 how much it cost you. 1044 00:39:55,350 --> 00:39:57,689 So we build a tool that to be paid 1045 00:39:57,690 --> 00:40:00,059 freely to connect to your 1046 00:40:00,060 --> 00:40:01,709 contact your representative freely. 1047 00:40:03,030 --> 00:40:05,099 It's a free like it's really free as 1048 00:40:05,100 --> 00:40:07,589 in free beer and free as in freedom. 1049 00:40:07,590 --> 00:40:08,640 As you know, 1050 00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:11,669 there is also a little lab. 1051 00:40:11,670 --> 00:40:13,379 Please take a look at this. 1052 00:40:13,380 --> 00:40:14,460 It's it's fun. 1053 00:40:15,690 --> 00:40:18,389 The other one that's a documentation 1054 00:40:18,390 --> 00:40:19,949 of what we were talking a lot about 1055 00:40:19,950 --> 00:40:21,449 documentation before. 1056 00:40:21,450 --> 00:40:23,549 And our wiki is used to document all 1057 00:40:23,550 --> 00:40:25,409 the work, all our analyzes. 1058 00:40:25,410 --> 00:40:27,629 And it was very, very heavily 1059 00:40:27,630 --> 00:40:29,549 used to prepare this conference because 1060 00:40:29,550 --> 00:40:31,619 trying to find backing to months 1061 00:40:31,620 --> 00:40:32,939 and months of press release is more 1062 00:40:32,940 --> 00:40:34,529 complicated. But when you have a wiki 1063 00:40:34,530 --> 00:40:35,819 with all the information really well 1064 00:40:35,820 --> 00:40:37,530 structured, it's important 1065 00:40:38,730 --> 00:40:41,339 also to note that 1066 00:40:41,340 --> 00:40:43,289 during the first week of the state of 1067 00:40:43,290 --> 00:40:45,569 emergency that there 1068 00:40:45,570 --> 00:40:46,739 is not on the slide because I just 1069 00:40:46,740 --> 00:40:47,699 thought about this. 1070 00:40:47,700 --> 00:40:49,829 But people started to make a list 1071 00:40:49,830 --> 00:40:51,030 of all the 1072 00:40:52,050 --> 00:40:54,749 violation of rights 1073 00:40:54,750 --> 00:40:56,419 during the house searches and they're 1074 00:40:56,420 --> 00:40:58,709 under house arrest and or a wiki page. 1075 00:40:58,710 --> 00:41:00,059 When you go on the first page, you can 1076 00:41:00,060 --> 00:41:01,769 find it very quickly. 1077 00:41:01,770 --> 00:41:03,899 There is a list of all press 1078 00:41:03,900 --> 00:41:06,179 articles speaking about a violation 1079 00:41:06,180 --> 00:41:08,489 during the first weeks and first month 1080 00:41:08,490 --> 00:41:09,869 of the state of emergency. 1081 00:41:09,870 --> 00:41:11,070 This list is huge 1082 00:41:12,570 --> 00:41:13,949 just for that. 1083 00:41:13,950 --> 00:41:15,510 Wikis are important people. 1084 00:41:16,950 --> 00:41:18,179 Then you have respect, Meynet. 1085 00:41:18,180 --> 00:41:19,439 I don't know if some people were on to 1086 00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:21,359 talk in your hold to on day one. 1087 00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:23,489 We're thinking about speaking about net 1088 00:41:23,490 --> 00:41:25,679 neutrality and basically respect 1089 00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:27,729 my net. That also has a website to 1090 00:41:27,730 --> 00:41:29,849 respect my net. That EU 1091 00:41:29,850 --> 00:41:31,979 is a tool that allows to 1092 00:41:31,980 --> 00:41:34,169 spot the violation of net neutrality 1093 00:41:35,530 --> 00:41:38,519 are really go back to that conference 1094 00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,739 and you have question as they come talk 1095 00:41:40,740 --> 00:41:42,869 to me. And there are other things that 1096 00:41:42,870 --> 00:41:44,649 are more part of the new strategy of that 1097 00:41:44,650 --> 00:41:45,539 quadrature. 1098 00:41:45,540 --> 00:41:46,919 Crypto parties and the network of 1099 00:41:46,920 --> 00:41:49,259 supporters, while crypto 1100 00:41:49,260 --> 00:41:51,509 parties, you've 1101 00:41:51,510 --> 00:41:53,129 been to some of them, you know what it 1102 00:41:53,130 --> 00:41:55,439 is, and it's still really 1103 00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:57,029 important. It's still relevant. 1104 00:41:57,030 --> 00:42:00,059 Maybe the way that we were doing them is 1105 00:42:00,060 --> 00:42:01,529 good. Maybe we have to change the way 1106 00:42:01,530 --> 00:42:03,869 we're doing them. Nonetheless, sharing 1107 00:42:03,870 --> 00:42:06,029 our experiences, sharing 1108 00:42:06,030 --> 00:42:07,739 our knowledge, sharing our best 1109 00:42:07,740 --> 00:42:09,809 practices, sharing our error is 1110 00:42:09,810 --> 00:42:12,119 making us a better a better community 1111 00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:14,009 is making me better tools. 1112 00:42:14,010 --> 00:42:15,599 So we have to keep doing that. 1113 00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:17,969 We are working with people trying 1114 00:42:17,970 --> 00:42:20,099 to go back 1115 00:42:20,100 --> 00:42:22,169 in new ideas and doing crypto parties 1116 00:42:22,170 --> 00:42:24,359 and so on. More than just the 1117 00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:26,829 usual crypto party think saying people 1118 00:42:26,830 --> 00:42:28,979 are more to that. 1119 00:42:28,980 --> 00:42:30,209 There's been a lot of talk about 1120 00:42:30,210 --> 00:42:31,799 encryption and security out here at the 1121 00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:34,089 CCC and your privacy issue as well. 1122 00:42:34,090 --> 00:42:35,789 And I'm sure in the future one. 1123 00:42:35,790 --> 00:42:37,859 So really, people talk 1124 00:42:37,860 --> 00:42:38,860 to each other. 1125 00:42:39,510 --> 00:42:42,089 And finally, the network of supporters 1126 00:42:42,090 --> 00:42:44,489 with which is the core thing 1127 00:42:44,490 --> 00:42:46,559 of what we can do, the 1128 00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:48,809 network of supporters, like any type 1129 00:42:48,810 --> 00:42:51,149 of NGO, is 1130 00:42:51,150 --> 00:42:53,039 the people that can make a living it, 1131 00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,109 that without the support of quadrature 1132 00:42:55,110 --> 00:42:57,419 will be nothing will just be 1133 00:42:57,420 --> 00:42:59,789 people in office 1134 00:42:59,790 --> 00:43:00,719 working something. 1135 00:43:00,720 --> 00:43:02,699 But when people speak about it, when 1136 00:43:02,700 --> 00:43:05,129 people contact 1137 00:43:05,130 --> 00:43:07,560 with it, we have 1138 00:43:09,630 --> 00:43:11,849 we have the ability to decentralize 1139 00:43:11,850 --> 00:43:13,799 a work and decentralize our 1140 00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:14,339 communication. 1141 00:43:14,340 --> 00:43:16,709 That makes us more resilient, because 1142 00:43:16,710 --> 00:43:18,779 if something falls there, well, the 1143 00:43:18,780 --> 00:43:20,459 rest can work. That's the basis of the 1144 00:43:20,460 --> 00:43:22,320 Internet, decentralized everything. 1145 00:43:23,490 --> 00:43:24,479 So that's it. 1146 00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:26,579 We know we can do it and we know 1147 00:43:26,580 --> 00:43:27,599 we are already doing it. 1148 00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:28,949 So let's keep doing this. 1149 00:43:30,330 --> 00:43:31,949 Let's go back to our conclusion. 1150 00:43:33,510 --> 00:43:35,579 I'm not here to tell you what 1151 00:43:35,580 --> 00:43:36,580 to do. 1152 00:43:37,320 --> 00:43:38,819 We are just presenting what you are doing 1153 00:43:38,820 --> 00:43:39,689 here in front. 1154 00:43:39,690 --> 00:43:41,339 But what is going on in your countries? 1155 00:43:41,340 --> 00:43:43,439 You're all from different countries, from 1156 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:45,989 the European Union and even 1157 00:43:45,990 --> 00:43:47,039 overseas. 1158 00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:49,589 So what laws are adopted 1159 00:43:49,590 --> 00:43:51,119 in your country? Why? 1160 00:43:51,120 --> 00:43:53,249 What type of legislation 1161 00:43:53,250 --> 00:43:55,049 is regulating surveillance? 1162 00:43:55,050 --> 00:43:57,029 And what, for example, are you doing 1163 00:43:57,030 --> 00:43:58,839 about that? What about doing all the 1164 00:43:58,840 --> 00:43:59,729 litigation work? 1165 00:43:59,730 --> 00:44:02,429 Let's join a huge European 1166 00:44:02,430 --> 00:44:04,499 litigation work and let's hack 1167 00:44:04,500 --> 00:44:06,479 again the system because advocacy worked. 1168 00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:08,369 Maybe we'll have to think about new ways 1169 00:44:08,370 --> 00:44:10,199 to make a right and to speak about the 1170 00:44:10,200 --> 00:44:11,699 rights in the next years. 1171 00:44:11,700 --> 00:44:14,099 So fingers 1172 00:44:14,100 --> 00:44:16,019 of what? What are you doing? 1173 00:44:16,020 --> 00:44:18,029 And we are really interesting in knowing 1174 00:44:18,030 --> 00:44:19,619 what we're doing. Let's get together 1175 00:44:19,620 --> 00:44:20,519 decentralized thing. 1176 00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:22,979 Let's make all the types of 1177 00:44:22,980 --> 00:44:23,969 litigation work. 1178 00:44:23,970 --> 00:44:25,499 Other types of crypto parties are the 1179 00:44:25,500 --> 00:44:27,269 type of tools that allow us to 1180 00:44:27,270 --> 00:44:29,579 communicate, allow us to make a right 1181 00:44:29,580 --> 00:44:31,859 important and to connect 1182 00:44:31,860 --> 00:44:33,959 and to participate in the public 1183 00:44:33,960 --> 00:44:36,899 debate because, well, democracy 1184 00:44:36,900 --> 00:44:38,579 is alive because of the people. 1185 00:44:38,580 --> 00:44:39,539 The people are not allowed. 1186 00:44:39,540 --> 00:44:40,540 There is no democracy. 1187 00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:42,860 So that's that's. 1188 00:44:48,830 --> 00:44:51,649 You have the credits for almost 1189 00:44:51,650 --> 00:44:53,839 everything I've put in there in 1190 00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:56,039 the slides 1191 00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:58,969 and the extra judicial access to 1192 00:44:58,970 --> 00:45:01,279 metadata, its techniques, so 1193 00:45:01,280 --> 00:45:03,499 you have this on the rekey, the 1194 00:45:03,500 --> 00:45:05,359 United Nations report on the use of 1195 00:45:05,360 --> 00:45:08,329 Internet for Tim's purposes, the icon 1196 00:45:08,330 --> 00:45:10,669 there is twice the same file that 1197 00:45:10,670 --> 00:45:12,739 there's a big shout 1198 00:45:12,740 --> 00:45:15,289 out to Tom Gate who made the file with 1199 00:45:15,290 --> 00:45:16,689 the whole techniques and all 1200 00:45:16,690 --> 00:45:19,129 administration. That was a huge work. 1201 00:45:19,130 --> 00:45:20,509 Thank you very much to that. 1202 00:45:20,510 --> 00:45:22,609 You have to visit the database 1203 00:45:22,610 --> 00:45:24,259 on the forensic cowritten, all done by 1204 00:45:24,260 --> 00:45:26,599 our graphic designer 1205 00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:28,729 Gondar and the Privacy Commission 1206 00:45:28,730 --> 00:45:30,379 on that page. There is a lot of coming up 1207 00:45:30,380 --> 00:45:31,729 with privacy. Some of them are really, 1208 00:45:31,730 --> 00:45:34,189 really funny. Go over there. 1209 00:45:34,190 --> 00:45:35,749 Finally, if you have questions and 1210 00:45:35,750 --> 00:45:37,909 contact us website, we are on 1211 00:45:37,910 --> 00:45:40,099 an ongoing fundraising campaign 1212 00:45:40,100 --> 00:45:42,199 as every year we are around 70 1213 00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:44,089 percent of our budget. 1214 00:45:44,090 --> 00:45:45,889 If you're interested in, please support 1215 00:45:45,890 --> 00:45:47,689 us and thank you. 1216 00:45:47,690 --> 00:45:49,370 And if you have questions we want to let. 1217 00:46:04,650 --> 00:46:07,079 If you have questions for Agnes 1218 00:46:07,080 --> 00:46:09,749 and Chris, there are four 1219 00:46:09,750 --> 00:46:11,669 microphones on the sides, please come to 1220 00:46:11,670 --> 00:46:13,139 the microphone. We don't have so much 1221 00:46:13,140 --> 00:46:14,339 time. 1222 00:46:14,340 --> 00:46:16,319 So let's start right away with the 1223 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:18,629 microphone on this side piece. 1224 00:46:18,630 --> 00:46:20,669 I have a general question about the 1225 00:46:20,670 --> 00:46:22,889 French situation as 1226 00:46:22,890 --> 00:46:24,689 far as terrorism is concerned. 1227 00:46:24,690 --> 00:46:27,089 Is there any debate whatsoever 1228 00:46:27,090 --> 00:46:29,399 in France that that perhaps 1229 00:46:29,400 --> 00:46:31,319 may have something to do with French 1230 00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:33,540 colonialism in the past centuries? 1231 00:46:34,740 --> 00:46:35,740 No. 1232 00:46:37,650 --> 00:46:39,929 No is on colonialism, it's 1233 00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:43,739 it's well, I remember in the 1234 00:46:43,740 --> 00:46:46,109 in the November 20th 1235 00:46:46,110 --> 00:46:48,179 of last year, in 1236 00:46:48,180 --> 00:46:50,369 November, French 1237 00:46:50,370 --> 00:46:52,499 French Prime Minister Manuel 1238 00:46:52,500 --> 00:46:54,839 Valls said something very 1239 00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:57,689 strong and that's really 1240 00:46:57,690 --> 00:46:59,429 illustrated how French 1241 00:47:00,540 --> 00:47:02,699 power we're seeing terrorism, at least at 1242 00:47:02,700 --> 00:47:04,949 that time, it was 1243 00:47:04,950 --> 00:47:07,379 explaining, is already trying to 1244 00:47:07,380 --> 00:47:09,989 forget for four forgive. 1245 00:47:09,990 --> 00:47:11,039 Yes, that's a word. 1246 00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:13,319 So explaining is trying to forgive. 1247 00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:14,609 What does that mean about the 1248 00:47:14,610 --> 00:47:16,709 understanding of such a complicated 1249 00:47:16,710 --> 00:47:18,899 issue as what Europe is going through 1250 00:47:18,900 --> 00:47:19,889 right now? 1251 00:47:19,890 --> 00:47:22,889 So I guess the debate will happen 1252 00:47:22,890 --> 00:47:23,899 in the next year. 1253 00:47:23,900 --> 00:47:25,469 There are people working on the 1254 00:47:25,470 --> 00:47:27,659 antiracism front, big 1255 00:47:27,660 --> 00:47:30,029 shout out to them, but so far 1256 00:47:30,030 --> 00:47:32,519 in the big parliaments 1257 00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:34,769 and so on, this debate is not 1258 00:47:34,770 --> 00:47:37,409 really heard as French 1259 00:47:37,410 --> 00:47:39,359 politicians are very much on the 1260 00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:41,759 historical reaction 1261 00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:42,939 to to terrorism. 1262 00:47:42,940 --> 00:47:43,889 Like, this is crazy. 1263 00:47:43,890 --> 00:47:45,839 You have to do something or our values, 1264 00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:47,999 our life model lifestyle, everything 1265 00:47:48,000 --> 00:47:49,049 is attacked. 1266 00:47:49,050 --> 00:47:51,329 So so far, the debates were 1267 00:47:51,330 --> 00:47:53,010 not really one sided. 1268 00:47:54,940 --> 00:47:57,069 OK, then he in the front, please. 1269 00:47:57,070 --> 00:47:59,619 Yeah, I have a question regarding 1270 00:47:59,620 --> 00:48:01,449 the house rates you are talking about 1271 00:48:01,450 --> 00:48:02,949 that were, yeah. 1272 00:48:02,950 --> 00:48:04,839 Rising especially within the Muslim 1273 00:48:04,840 --> 00:48:07,059 community. And I think in Germany, 1274 00:48:07,060 --> 00:48:09,009 too, there are lots of people who are 1275 00:48:09,010 --> 00:48:11,349 referred to as suspects, although 1276 00:48:11,350 --> 00:48:12,579 there is no reason and there are. 1277 00:48:12,580 --> 00:48:15,009 So they surveyed also. 1278 00:48:15,010 --> 00:48:17,469 And I wanted to know if there is anything 1279 00:48:17,470 --> 00:48:19,599 on a policy level or maybe from the civil 1280 00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:22,389 society initiatives or organizations 1281 00:48:22,390 --> 00:48:23,390 working against that. 1282 00:48:26,950 --> 00:48:27,950 Well, 1283 00:48:29,360 --> 00:48:30,469 not so far. 1284 00:48:30,470 --> 00:48:32,849 The thing is that there have been few 1285 00:48:32,850 --> 00:48:35,059 court fines and court cases under 1286 00:48:35,060 --> 00:48:36,060 house arrest. 1287 00:48:36,780 --> 00:48:38,869 The what is interesting that 1288 00:48:38,870 --> 00:48:41,089 they really rushed everything after the 1289 00:48:41,090 --> 00:48:42,259 attacks of November. 1290 00:48:42,260 --> 00:48:44,659 And so things are getting settled 1291 00:48:44,660 --> 00:48:46,939 and first things are getting 1292 00:48:48,110 --> 00:48:49,759 judge. And for example, there are people 1293 00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:52,639 that are still under house arrest 1294 00:48:52,640 --> 00:48:55,039 since November last week, 1295 00:48:55,040 --> 00:48:56,089 this year. 1296 00:48:56,090 --> 00:48:58,279 So this is like we don't 1297 00:48:58,280 --> 00:48:59,419 know whether I guess in the future 1298 00:48:59,420 --> 00:49:00,229 something will come up. 1299 00:49:00,230 --> 00:49:02,509 But so far, the 1300 00:49:02,510 --> 00:49:04,619 civil society working that this is 1301 00:49:04,620 --> 00:49:06,859 an amnesty and the league, 1302 00:49:06,860 --> 00:49:09,019 the dalam human 1303 00:49:09,020 --> 00:49:11,299 human rights would like, you know, not 1304 00:49:11,300 --> 00:49:13,309 criminal throughout, but the Human Rights 1305 00:49:13,310 --> 00:49:15,379 League or OK, are 1306 00:49:15,380 --> 00:49:17,110 working on that and get in. 1307 00:49:18,740 --> 00:49:20,089 Then we have a question from the 1308 00:49:20,090 --> 00:49:21,319 Internet. 1309 00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:23,389 Yes, the IRS is asking basically 1310 00:49:23,390 --> 00:49:25,459 two questions. First of all, Ecco, 21 1311 00:49:25,460 --> 00:49:27,899 asks, you mentioned about 3000 searches 1312 00:49:27,900 --> 00:49:30,109 since the state of emergency was enacted. 1313 00:49:30,110 --> 00:49:31,849 Do you know how many convictions for 1314 00:49:31,850 --> 00:49:33,949 crimes these have resulted in? 1315 00:49:33,950 --> 00:49:35,959 Yes, but I didn't I forgot to put the 1316 00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:37,369 numbers. Let me 1317 00:49:38,380 --> 00:49:40,489 let me try to find out if 1318 00:49:40,490 --> 00:49:42,529 you have my Great Wall paper here. 1319 00:49:42,530 --> 00:49:44,209 I hope this OK was here. 1320 00:49:44,210 --> 00:49:45,529 Great. 1321 00:49:45,530 --> 00:49:48,079 I know I found the and 1322 00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:50,389 those numbers are from the report 1323 00:49:50,390 --> 00:49:51,769 on the first month. 1324 00:49:51,770 --> 00:49:52,999 It's not since last year. 1325 00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:54,649 That's a first month of state of 1326 00:49:54,650 --> 00:49:55,650 emergency. 1327 00:49:57,830 --> 00:49:59,209 And that the report was issued on the 1328 00:49:59,210 --> 00:50:00,559 third month. 1329 00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:04,549 Uh, what is this. 1330 00:50:04,550 --> 00:50:07,309 Yep. So there was the French 1331 00:50:07,310 --> 00:50:08,599 newspaper. 1332 00:50:08,600 --> 00:50:11,029 Le Monde has a section called 1333 00:50:11,030 --> 00:50:13,459 The Decoders, and they're try doing data 1334 00:50:13,460 --> 00:50:14,899 on the numbers and so on. 1335 00:50:14,900 --> 00:50:17,149 So basically, it's very small, but 1336 00:50:17,150 --> 00:50:18,320 you have four hundred. 1337 00:50:19,630 --> 00:50:21,319 That was after three months, I think if I 1338 00:50:21,320 --> 00:50:23,029 remember well, that was after on the 1339 00:50:23,030 --> 00:50:25,129 report that our four hundred house 1340 00:50:25,130 --> 00:50:26,689 arrest there are two hundred and ninety 1341 00:50:26,690 --> 00:50:27,769 still active. 1342 00:50:27,770 --> 00:50:30,139 There has been three 1343 00:50:30,140 --> 00:50:32,269 judicial procedure 1344 00:50:32,270 --> 00:50:34,760 with 28 on terrorism, 1345 00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:38,239 23 for apology of terrorism. 1346 00:50:38,240 --> 00:50:40,699 I well eight being linked 1347 00:50:40,700 --> 00:50:42,919 to terrorism and five real 1348 00:50:42,920 --> 00:50:44,089 for terrorism. 1349 00:50:44,090 --> 00:50:45,710 So that's very small. 1350 00:50:46,910 --> 00:50:49,009 And there 1351 00:50:49,010 --> 00:50:50,569 we know that the next number I'm just 1352 00:50:50,570 --> 00:50:52,879 reading that for the information that 1353 00:50:52,880 --> 00:50:55,009 twenty, thirty eight individuals 1354 00:50:55,010 --> 00:50:57,109 that have been followed 1355 00:50:57,110 --> 00:50:59,989 by the French Secret Services DGSE, 1356 00:50:59,990 --> 00:51:02,419 which is the interior services and 1357 00:51:02,420 --> 00:51:04,519 among which 320 have 1358 00:51:04,520 --> 00:51:07,159 been already contacted. 1359 00:51:08,270 --> 00:51:10,339 So this has been 1360 00:51:10,340 --> 00:51:12,229 done in January 2016. 1361 00:51:12,230 --> 00:51:14,299 So it was a year 1362 00:51:14,300 --> 00:51:16,309 ago, three months after the start of the 1363 00:51:16,310 --> 00:51:16,729 government. 1364 00:51:16,730 --> 00:51:18,409 And those numbers are outdated. 1365 00:51:18,410 --> 00:51:20,719 Yeah, we have no idea what the new one. 1366 00:51:20,720 --> 00:51:22,099 Thank you for that. And the second 1367 00:51:22,100 --> 00:51:24,169 question is by Trussville. 1368 00:51:24,170 --> 00:51:26,629 He basically asks in your eyes, how 1369 00:51:26,630 --> 00:51:29,089 big is the impact of the extra 1370 00:51:29,090 --> 00:51:31,009 Amadu on the situation in France? 1371 00:51:31,010 --> 00:51:32,929 Is it more than a voice to articulate 1372 00:51:32,930 --> 00:51:34,489 disagreement with the status quo? 1373 00:51:37,330 --> 00:51:39,309 I think it's from Internet, so I guess 1374 00:51:39,310 --> 00:51:41,289 it's not this person is not here right 1375 00:51:41,290 --> 00:51:43,509 now, otherwise I would have 1376 00:51:43,510 --> 00:51:45,119 I would tell him to go ask them. 1377 00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:47,979 Nonetheless, I think we are creating a 1378 00:51:47,980 --> 00:51:50,079 lot of jurisprudence that could 1379 00:51:50,080 --> 00:51:51,939 be used from other countries in Europe or 1380 00:51:51,940 --> 00:51:54,069 in the world or in France 1381 00:51:54,070 --> 00:51:55,719 for that kind of issue. 1382 00:51:55,720 --> 00:51:58,029 Yeah, I think the influence well, 1383 00:51:58,030 --> 00:52:00,339 the the impact of the exegete 1384 00:52:00,340 --> 00:52:01,630 is increasing 1385 00:52:03,820 --> 00:52:04,629 time after time. 1386 00:52:04,630 --> 00:52:06,880 I mean, like and. 1387 00:52:09,220 --> 00:52:11,349 I mean, now people are contacting us 1388 00:52:11,350 --> 00:52:13,809 on Twitter to ask us to 1389 00:52:13,810 --> 00:52:16,539 challenge a new law or change 1390 00:52:16,540 --> 00:52:18,789 anything that that are coming, and 1391 00:52:18,790 --> 00:52:20,949 that is not great. So, I mean, I 1392 00:52:20,950 --> 00:52:22,690 think that there is something that is, 1393 00:52:24,310 --> 00:52:25,119 you know. 1394 00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:27,459 Oh, yeah, I've 1395 00:52:27,460 --> 00:52:28,989 been on going since two years only. 1396 00:52:28,990 --> 00:52:30,070 So that's very, very young. 1397 00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:33,659 OK, then the microphone in the back 1398 00:52:33,660 --> 00:52:36,569 there, please. Hi, I. 1399 00:52:36,570 --> 00:52:38,519 Could you talk a little bit more about 1400 00:52:38,520 --> 00:52:41,279 the role litigation has had in activism 1401 00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:43,499 and creating political change, especially 1402 00:52:43,500 --> 00:52:44,789 if you have any examples about your 1403 00:52:44,790 --> 00:52:45,790 experience with it? 1404 00:52:48,490 --> 00:52:50,679 You mean, yeah, the impact of litigation 1405 00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:52,809 in activism, I think it's very 1406 00:52:52,810 --> 00:52:55,119 important just because right now 1407 00:52:55,120 --> 00:52:57,489 we feel that advocacy in France 1408 00:52:57,490 --> 00:52:59,139 at least advocacy is not 1409 00:53:01,150 --> 00:53:02,539 enough to change things. 1410 00:53:02,540 --> 00:53:04,809 So you fight as you can 1411 00:53:04,810 --> 00:53:06,939 against, for example, for surveillance 1412 00:53:06,940 --> 00:53:08,649 law in 2015. 1413 00:53:08,650 --> 00:53:09,819 We fought a lot. 1414 00:53:09,820 --> 00:53:11,399 We were like that. 1415 00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:13,809 I was at the top of the 1416 00:53:13,810 --> 00:53:16,119 leader in the fighting against this law. 1417 00:53:16,120 --> 00:53:18,489 And finally 1418 00:53:18,490 --> 00:53:20,799 we we lost because 1419 00:53:20,800 --> 00:53:21,739 it was adopted. 1420 00:53:21,740 --> 00:53:24,039 And even 1421 00:53:24,040 --> 00:53:26,409 on that, we can create a huge coalition 1422 00:53:26,410 --> 00:53:27,739 of where you 1423 00:53:29,420 --> 00:53:31,479 would create a huge coalition 1424 00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,549 with private sector private companies, 1425 00:53:33,550 --> 00:53:35,889 start ups also with 1426 00:53:35,890 --> 00:53:38,019 NGO friendly for human rights 1427 00:53:38,020 --> 00:53:40,089 and other type of ofri in 1428 00:53:40,090 --> 00:53:41,349 general, civil rights. 1429 00:53:41,350 --> 00:53:42,399 The coalition was huge. 1430 00:53:42,400 --> 00:53:43,399 Also individuals. 1431 00:53:43,400 --> 00:53:45,729 I mean, there have been lawyers, very 1432 00:53:45,730 --> 00:53:47,739 known and top lawyers to try standing 1433 00:53:47,740 --> 00:53:48,789 against that. 1434 00:53:48,790 --> 00:53:50,149 And the government was deaf to that. 1435 00:53:50,150 --> 00:53:52,299 So maybe if it's not working, let's back 1436 00:53:52,300 --> 00:53:53,259 away from that. 1437 00:53:53,260 --> 00:53:53,589 Yeah. 1438 00:53:53,590 --> 00:53:55,779 And then it's important to 1439 00:53:55,780 --> 00:53:57,849 us to have other solutions afterwards to 1440 00:53:57,850 --> 00:54:00,579 fight against. And it 1441 00:54:00,580 --> 00:54:02,769 enables all the people to participate 1442 00:54:02,770 --> 00:54:04,929 because some of the people would not be 1443 00:54:04,930 --> 00:54:07,059 able or would not like to do some 1444 00:54:07,060 --> 00:54:09,159 advocacy, but can help to 1445 00:54:09,160 --> 00:54:10,270 do some litigation. 1446 00:54:11,320 --> 00:54:13,869 It enables also to 1447 00:54:13,870 --> 00:54:16,569 collaborate, cooperate with other 1448 00:54:16,570 --> 00:54:18,699 NGOs doing the same thing on 1449 00:54:18,700 --> 00:54:21,130 litigation or the in other countries 1450 00:54:22,270 --> 00:54:24,589 and to create. Nuh nuh 1451 00:54:24,590 --> 00:54:26,769 nuh nuh nuh. 1452 00:54:26,770 --> 00:54:28,929 Yeah. New networks. 1453 00:54:28,930 --> 00:54:31,179 Um, so 1454 00:54:31,180 --> 00:54:33,369 it's, I think it's, it's complementary 1455 00:54:33,370 --> 00:54:35,619 and it's very important to keep 1456 00:54:35,620 --> 00:54:38,019 going with it because and 1457 00:54:38,020 --> 00:54:40,089 and it's also when you 1458 00:54:40,090 --> 00:54:42,309 cannot find a way 1459 00:54:42,310 --> 00:54:44,469 to um 1460 00:54:44,470 --> 00:54:46,719 for example for that are retention. 1461 00:54:47,740 --> 00:54:49,989 There is there was no way for 1462 00:54:49,990 --> 00:54:52,119 us to win at work to 1463 00:54:52,120 --> 00:54:53,560 to make it fall down 1464 00:54:55,150 --> 00:54:57,429 on the French level, 1465 00:54:57,430 --> 00:54:59,829 either by advocacy 1466 00:54:59,830 --> 00:55:02,319 or by French challengers 1467 00:55:02,320 --> 00:55:03,639 or court cases. 1468 00:55:03,640 --> 00:55:05,739 And it's at the European 1469 00:55:05,740 --> 00:55:07,809 Union level that we can 1470 00:55:07,810 --> 00:55:10,569 finally succeed. 1471 00:55:10,570 --> 00:55:12,909 So it's very important to 1472 00:55:12,910 --> 00:55:14,169 I mean, to 1473 00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:17,379 try everything. Yeah. 1474 00:55:17,380 --> 00:55:19,899 To try all the tool we have 1475 00:55:19,900 --> 00:55:21,879 to to succeed to it. 1476 00:55:21,880 --> 00:55:22,880 Yeah. 1477 00:55:23,690 --> 00:55:25,489 OK, thank you. Then up here in the front, 1478 00:55:25,490 --> 00:55:26,490 please. 1479 00:55:27,610 --> 00:55:29,679 In my opinion, calling the state of 1480 00:55:29,680 --> 00:55:31,929 emergency is a 1481 00:55:31,930 --> 00:55:34,209 slight overreaction on the topic, 1482 00:55:34,210 --> 00:55:35,260 but what is the 1483 00:55:36,280 --> 00:55:39,489 public opinion in France on this? 1484 00:55:39,490 --> 00:55:41,679 All the people seem viewing 1485 00:55:41,680 --> 00:55:43,869 that a state of emergency being 1486 00:55:43,870 --> 00:55:46,089 called right now and extended every 1487 00:55:46,090 --> 00:55:46,239 year. 1488 00:55:46,240 --> 00:55:48,309 And then, first of all, a 1489 00:55:48,310 --> 00:55:50,239 state of emergency is not a name of us. 1490 00:55:50,240 --> 00:55:52,299 That's the name of the actual state. 1491 00:55:52,300 --> 00:55:53,829 It's called the journalists from Allo 1492 00:55:53,830 --> 00:55:56,259 from the in 1955 on the public opinion. 1493 00:55:56,260 --> 00:55:57,610 It has been changing a lot. 1494 00:55:59,860 --> 00:56:02,589 I think considering public opinion. 1495 00:56:02,590 --> 00:56:04,209 It's really complicated as 1496 00:56:05,260 --> 00:56:06,999 public opinion. It depends where you pick 1497 00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:09,039 it. Do it from your friends. 1498 00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:11,529 Do you pick it from a study? 1499 00:56:11,530 --> 00:56:12,879 Do you pick it from general? 1500 00:56:12,880 --> 00:56:14,449 What media are saying? 1501 00:56:14,450 --> 00:56:16,799 So what happens is that also 1502 00:56:16,800 --> 00:56:19,179 they see the relation with the general 1503 00:56:19,180 --> 00:56:20,169 reaction. 1504 00:56:20,170 --> 00:56:21,759 And I think it's if you can link it with 1505 00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:23,889 the CHOUX tragedy, defining them 1506 00:56:23,890 --> 00:56:24,819 is Cranebrook. 1507 00:56:24,820 --> 00:56:27,249 So after the attacks, of course, everyone 1508 00:56:27,250 --> 00:56:30,399 was saying we want more security, but 1509 00:56:30,400 --> 00:56:32,799 we can see that even as France adopted 1510 00:56:32,800 --> 00:56:34,989 an anti-terrorism law every 1511 00:56:34,990 --> 00:56:37,689 year for the past twenty years, 1512 00:56:37,690 --> 00:56:39,789 twenty five years, we have still this 1513 00:56:39,790 --> 00:56:42,729 problem. And there is something that 1514 00:56:42,730 --> 00:56:44,529 politicians try to advocate that they 1515 00:56:44,530 --> 00:56:45,999 will fix things. 1516 00:56:46,000 --> 00:56:48,369 However, we know as we are geeks, 1517 00:56:48,370 --> 00:56:50,259 hackers and so on, that perfect security 1518 00:56:50,260 --> 00:56:51,489 is impossible. 1519 00:56:51,490 --> 00:56:53,289 So on the public opinion, I think there 1520 00:56:53,290 --> 00:56:55,649 is we are living a 1521 00:56:55,650 --> 00:56:57,069 a turmoil. 1522 00:56:57,070 --> 00:56:58,509 On one side, you have the rise of 1523 00:56:58,510 --> 00:57:01,059 populist leaders such as a Marine Le Pen. 1524 00:57:01,060 --> 00:57:03,369 On the other side, you have the left 1525 00:57:03,370 --> 00:57:05,889 wing parties going for security 1526 00:57:05,890 --> 00:57:08,229 and the politics are played by 1527 00:57:08,230 --> 00:57:10,359 Manuel Valls. Wasn't a political 1528 00:57:10,360 --> 00:57:12,489 left wing politics such a strong right 1529 00:57:12,490 --> 00:57:14,499 wing politics that could have been done 1530 00:57:14,500 --> 00:57:17,259 by any kind of hard core Republican? 1531 00:57:17,260 --> 00:57:19,599 So I think we are in a time of a change 1532 00:57:19,600 --> 00:57:21,699 and we have to decide what do 1533 00:57:21,700 --> 00:57:22,719 we believe in? 1534 00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:24,429 What what do we want and what do we want 1535 00:57:24,430 --> 00:57:25,430 to do that will? 1536 00:57:26,410 --> 00:57:28,090 And I would just add 1537 00:57:29,140 --> 00:57:31,359 something, which is 1538 00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:33,729 even people get used 1539 00:57:33,730 --> 00:57:35,439 to the state of emergency, gets used to 1540 00:57:35,440 --> 00:57:38,169 be search the bags at 1541 00:57:38,170 --> 00:57:40,479 each time you go in a shop, get used 1542 00:57:40,480 --> 00:57:42,579 to, you know, 1543 00:57:42,580 --> 00:57:44,739 having to show your bags to take 1544 00:57:44,740 --> 00:57:47,439 the train or anything like this 1545 00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:49,539 and to have less freedoms on the 1546 00:57:49,540 --> 00:57:51,909 Internet or less freedoms 1547 00:57:51,910 --> 00:57:52,910 anyhow. 1548 00:57:54,850 --> 00:57:57,069 I mean, they're getting 1549 00:57:57,070 --> 00:57:59,289 used to be in a more 1550 00:58:01,120 --> 00:58:03,189 well to lose their freedom, 1551 00:58:03,190 --> 00:58:04,869 you know, and 1552 00:58:06,790 --> 00:58:09,519 and this is absolutely not what we want. 1553 00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:12,339 So we try 1554 00:58:12,340 --> 00:58:13,839 to oppose this. 1555 00:58:13,840 --> 00:58:14,840 That's it. 1556 00:58:18,420 --> 00:58:20,489 Then the Internet again, please. 1557 00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:24,389 We had a huge feedback 1558 00:58:24,390 --> 00:58:26,609 on Twitter, and, of course, many people 1559 00:58:26,610 --> 00:58:28,379 are asking, is this a blueprint for other 1560 00:58:28,380 --> 00:58:29,459 countries as well? 1561 00:58:29,460 --> 00:58:31,659 But Pourri Keyon 1562 00:58:31,660 --> 00:58:33,749 in Ayers's especially asking what 1563 00:58:33,750 --> 00:58:35,459 is the current state of affairs in 1564 00:58:35,460 --> 00:58:36,809 Belgium? 1565 00:58:36,810 --> 00:58:38,399 Oh, do you know something about that? 1566 00:58:43,410 --> 00:58:45,489 The innovation has have 1567 00:58:45,490 --> 00:58:47,429 adopted few security laws 1568 00:58:48,810 --> 00:58:50,489 for having been in mean. 1569 00:58:50,490 --> 00:58:53,009 I've not have such in-depth knowledge 1570 00:58:53,010 --> 00:58:55,319 about the legislation on that. 1571 00:58:55,320 --> 00:58:57,439 Nonetheless, I think Belgium is less 1572 00:58:57,440 --> 00:58:59,559 trama drama queen about that. 1573 00:58:59,560 --> 00:59:00,560 I'd said I'd like this. 1574 00:59:03,570 --> 00:59:05,939 They have been in Brazil just after the 1575 00:59:05,940 --> 00:59:07,919 attacks in Brussels and the reaction 1576 00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:09,599 between Paris and Brussels was very, very 1577 00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:10,600 different 1578 00:59:11,700 --> 00:59:12,839 from the other type of issue. 1579 00:59:12,840 --> 00:59:14,399 For example, also that they have this far 1580 00:59:14,400 --> 00:59:17,369 right wing political party, 1581 00:59:17,370 --> 00:59:18,809 racist political party out of power. 1582 00:59:18,810 --> 00:59:21,419 So that's another type of problem. 1583 00:59:21,420 --> 00:59:23,489 So I would say 1584 00:59:23,490 --> 00:59:25,559 go ask Naropa, which is the 1585 00:59:25,560 --> 00:59:27,689 natural rights protection 1586 00:59:27,690 --> 00:59:29,339 organization in Belgium. 1587 00:59:29,340 --> 00:59:30,569 So maybe go ask them. 1588 00:59:30,570 --> 00:59:32,210 They may know more than me. 1589 00:59:33,490 --> 00:59:34,490 Thanks. 1590 00:59:34,900 --> 00:59:37,539 And then over here, please, if 1591 00:59:37,540 --> 00:59:39,369 I may refer back to Belgium because I 1592 00:59:39,370 --> 00:59:41,469 live in Brussels, I have seen the 1593 00:59:41,470 --> 00:59:42,489 situation. 1594 00:59:42,490 --> 00:59:44,859 I think it's good because 1595 00:59:44,860 --> 00:59:46,549 the government are already chaotic 1596 00:59:46,550 --> 00:59:48,609 enough. So they cannot really take a 1597 00:59:48,610 --> 00:59:50,379 stance on this. And the only comment they 1598 00:59:50,380 --> 00:59:52,659 made so far was blaming PlayStation 1599 00:59:52,660 --> 00:59:54,879 four encryption and communication 1600 00:59:54,880 --> 00:59:56,439 among terrorists. 1601 00:59:56,440 --> 00:59:58,389 That was the minister of interior 1602 00:59:58,390 --> 00:59:59,439 company. Bullshit. 1603 00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:02,109 But coming back to France, 1604 01:00:02,110 --> 01:00:04,869 what's the do you have any allies among 1605 01:00:04,870 --> 01:00:07,779 public figures or any political 1606 01:00:07,780 --> 01:00:09,459 parties? Maybe not parties, but 1607 01:00:09,460 --> 01:00:11,739 politicians who voice your concerns 1608 01:00:11,740 --> 01:00:13,329 and your calls? What's the state of the 1609 01:00:13,330 --> 01:00:14,469 public debate? 1610 01:00:14,470 --> 01:00:15,849 And do you foresee that after the 1611 01:00:15,850 --> 01:00:17,830 elections in case for national wins? 1612 01:00:19,250 --> 01:00:20,349 Can it go anywhere? 1613 01:00:22,250 --> 01:00:23,359 I'm not asking that question. 1614 01:00:23,360 --> 01:00:24,979 I will not answer that question 1615 01:00:26,270 --> 01:00:27,739 and can get anywhere that I mean, the 1616 01:00:27,740 --> 01:00:29,149 second part on the first part, we have 1617 01:00:29,150 --> 01:00:30,229 politicians that are 1618 01:00:31,490 --> 01:00:33,469 there that are supporting us a little 1619 01:00:33,470 --> 01:00:33,739 bit. 1620 01:00:33,740 --> 01:00:35,839 Yeah, or a lot. 1621 01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:38,089 But few of them I mean, 1622 01:00:38,090 --> 01:00:39,839 especially the member of parliament. 1623 01:00:39,840 --> 01:00:41,899 Well, we know we have 1624 01:00:41,900 --> 01:00:43,399 a socialist government. 1625 01:00:43,400 --> 01:00:45,889 You know, the government is socialist 1626 01:00:45,890 --> 01:00:48,079 one, but it's an extreme right 1627 01:00:48,080 --> 01:00:49,399 one as well. 1628 01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:51,529 So depending on the 1629 01:00:51,530 --> 01:00:53,689 official name or the right 1630 01:00:53,690 --> 01:00:54,690 situation. 1631 01:00:57,020 --> 01:00:59,209 So 1632 01:00:59,210 --> 01:01:01,309 among the socialists on the left wings, 1633 01:01:01,310 --> 01:01:03,649 we have support in the green 1634 01:01:03,650 --> 01:01:05,869 side or depending 1635 01:01:05,870 --> 01:01:07,849 on we have a little bit. 1636 01:01:07,850 --> 01:01:08,850 But 1637 01:01:10,040 --> 01:01:11,959 among the member of parliament, I mean, 1638 01:01:11,960 --> 01:01:13,849 it's very few of them, and especially on 1639 01:01:13,850 --> 01:01:16,039 terrorism issue, if 1640 01:01:16,040 --> 01:01:17,599 they're told each time they have to add 1641 01:01:17,600 --> 01:01:19,279 something that they would be responsible 1642 01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:20,449 if they do not for the law. 1643 01:01:20,450 --> 01:01:23,029 So they do not want to be responsible 1644 01:01:23,030 --> 01:01:24,199 of the next attack. 1645 01:01:24,200 --> 01:01:26,059 So that's what the law. 1646 01:01:26,060 --> 01:01:28,579 So, I mean, the support 1647 01:01:28,580 --> 01:01:30,679 is not so strong 1648 01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:32,869 and the government is using a very that's 1649 01:01:32,870 --> 01:01:34,789 very part of the new prime minister of 1650 01:01:34,790 --> 01:01:37,069 France, Bernard Cazeneuve, that has 1651 01:01:37,070 --> 01:01:38,780 a very way of saying, 1652 01:01:40,130 --> 01:01:41,659 telling people that they should vote what 1653 01:01:41,660 --> 01:01:43,849 he's giving, that if you don't 1654 01:01:43,850 --> 01:01:45,709 vote first, you are against France, 1655 01:01:45,710 --> 01:01:48,049 you're against French values, and you 1656 01:01:48,050 --> 01:01:50,419 will be responsible for the next attack. 1657 01:01:50,420 --> 01:01:52,579 So as a politician, what does 1658 01:01:52,580 --> 01:01:54,259 that mean when you have your job, your 1659 01:01:54,260 --> 01:01:56,269 job is being that is chosen by the people 1660 01:01:56,270 --> 01:01:58,909 and you have to and after you are scared 1661 01:01:58,910 --> 01:02:00,319 that people are going to tell you that's 1662 01:02:00,320 --> 01:02:02,629 your fault, so you kind of vote 1663 01:02:02,630 --> 01:02:03,049 the same way. 1664 01:02:03,050 --> 01:02:05,119 He says, OK, we have 1665 01:02:05,120 --> 01:02:07,369 time for one more brief question 1666 01:02:07,370 --> 01:02:09,079 that goes to you. 1667 01:02:09,080 --> 01:02:11,449 So the EU seems 1668 01:02:11,450 --> 01:02:13,009 to be helping you guys a bit. 1669 01:02:13,010 --> 01:02:14,539 I mean, you're saying, you know, you go 1670 01:02:14,540 --> 01:02:16,459 over the French courts and to the EU 1671 01:02:16,460 --> 01:02:18,829 court and it's nice that the EU 1672 01:02:18,830 --> 01:02:20,359 is at least something of a force for 1673 01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:22,699 good. But how long will that last? 1674 01:02:22,700 --> 01:02:23,809 I mean, there are a lot of other 1675 01:02:23,810 --> 01:02:25,879 countries that are pushing the EU in 1676 01:02:25,880 --> 01:02:27,979 a, well, fascist direction, 1677 01:02:27,980 --> 01:02:29,629 to put it that way. 1678 01:02:29,630 --> 01:02:32,259 I mean, how long will this be helpful? 1679 01:02:32,260 --> 01:02:35,389 Um, it depends. 1680 01:02:35,390 --> 01:02:37,639 For example, what we talked about, 1681 01:02:37,640 --> 01:02:39,470 the EU Court of Justice 1682 01:02:40,790 --> 01:02:42,959 that helps us for 1683 01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:44,300 better retention, for example. 1684 01:02:46,730 --> 01:02:48,409 It's not always the case. 1685 01:02:48,410 --> 01:02:50,539 For example, the terrorism, the 1686 01:02:50,540 --> 01:02:53,419 directive on combating terrorism that is 1687 01:02:53,420 --> 01:02:55,489 currently negotiated 1688 01:02:55,490 --> 01:02:56,809 at the EU level 1689 01:02:58,010 --> 01:03:00,269 and will be adopted by the EU parliament 1690 01:03:00,270 --> 01:03:02,569 in January or the beginning 1691 01:03:02,570 --> 01:03:05,029 of February, probably is not very good. 1692 01:03:05,030 --> 01:03:07,399 And lots of French measures for 1693 01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:09,619 terrorism law are 1694 01:03:09,620 --> 01:03:11,689 put into this directive. 1695 01:03:11,690 --> 01:03:13,879 So you is not 1696 01:03:13,880 --> 01:03:15,079 always helping us, 1697 01:03:16,610 --> 01:03:18,559 but it's interesting for us to work with 1698 01:03:18,560 --> 01:03:19,730 the EU because 1699 01:03:21,740 --> 01:03:24,469 you go out from your French 1700 01:03:24,470 --> 01:03:27,079 French very close, 1701 01:03:27,080 --> 01:03:28,280 you know, mind, you know, 1702 01:03:29,480 --> 01:03:31,459 from the government and members of 1703 01:03:31,460 --> 01:03:33,589 parliament. So right now, this 1704 01:03:33,590 --> 01:03:36,019 is not always the EU that helps help 1705 01:03:36,020 --> 01:03:38,209 us, but not 1706 01:03:38,210 --> 01:03:40,099 all the part of the EU, but especially 1707 01:03:40,100 --> 01:03:41,100 the court. 1708 01:03:42,200 --> 01:03:44,389 And honestly, we do not know how long 1709 01:03:44,390 --> 01:03:46,909 it would last and we hope 1710 01:03:46,910 --> 01:03:48,980 it could help us to 1711 01:03:50,060 --> 01:03:51,169 keep going this way. 1712 01:03:51,170 --> 01:03:53,389 But, you know, 1713 01:03:54,890 --> 01:03:57,499 otherwise, if people have questions, 1714 01:03:57,500 --> 01:03:59,839 come see us at the teahouse afterwards. 1715 01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:01,669 And for the talk of the exegete at four 1716 01:04:01,670 --> 01:04:03,109 p.m.. What time is that again? 1717 01:04:03,110 --> 01:04:05,509 Four PM at four pm and 4th 1718 01:04:05,510 --> 01:04:07,699 floor, four PM, 4th floor right 1719 01:04:07,700 --> 01:04:09,830 in front of you. So make sure everyone.