0 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:30,000 Dear viewer, these subtitles were generated by a machine via the service Trint and therefore are (very) buggy. If you are capable, please help us to create good quality subtitles: https://c3subtitles.de/talk/904 Thanks! 1 00:00:17,270 --> 00:00:19,939 You'll hear a little bit about biohacking 2 00:00:19,940 --> 00:00:20,940 today, 3 00:00:23,300 --> 00:00:24,769 this lecture is called Open Source 4 00:00:24,770 --> 00:00:27,019 Estrogen, and 5 00:00:27,020 --> 00:00:29,269 it'll tell you a little bit about 6 00:00:29,270 --> 00:00:31,549 the possibilities and do 7 00:00:31,550 --> 00:00:33,769 it yourself, biohacking 8 00:00:33,770 --> 00:00:36,259 and extracting 9 00:00:36,260 --> 00:00:37,909 and detecting estrogen. 10 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:40,219 So it's do it yourself. 11 00:00:40,220 --> 00:00:41,539 Basically, you can probably do it in your 12 00:00:41,540 --> 00:00:43,039 own kitchen. So it's a lot of fun. 13 00:00:46,370 --> 00:00:48,469 This issue is relevant for 14 00:00:48,470 --> 00:00:49,470 many, many people 15 00:00:51,710 --> 00:00:54,829 because today hormone therapies are 16 00:00:54,830 --> 00:00:56,899 very normal and a 17 00:00:56,900 --> 00:00:59,149 lot of people, even though there are 18 00:00:59,150 --> 00:01:00,950 not that many. 19 00:01:02,710 --> 00:01:04,809 Problems and doing stuff don't 20 00:01:04,810 --> 00:01:06,279 get the therapies that they want, 21 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:10,599 so with open source estrogen, 22 00:01:10,600 --> 00:01:12,729 we have a solution for 23 00:01:12,730 --> 00:01:15,279 a small part, maybe 24 00:01:15,280 --> 00:01:17,709 for some of you that might 25 00:01:17,710 --> 00:01:19,330 actually change the world. 26 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:22,539 How that works will 27 00:01:22,540 --> 00:01:24,489 be explained by Maggie. 28 00:01:24,490 --> 00:01:26,230 Give me a warm welcome for her, please. 29 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:31,359 Yes. Have a great talk. 30 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:32,360 Thank you. 31 00:01:32,890 --> 00:01:33,890 Thanks. 32 00:01:35,140 --> 00:01:36,459 Hello. Hello. 33 00:01:36,460 --> 00:01:37,460 Can everyone hear me 34 00:01:38,830 --> 00:01:40,659 OK? Yeah. 35 00:01:40,660 --> 00:01:42,909 So thanks for the introduction. 36 00:01:42,910 --> 00:01:44,979 My name is Mary Magic and 37 00:01:44,980 --> 00:01:47,139 I'm born and raised in Los Angeles 38 00:01:47,140 --> 00:01:50,349 and now I'm based in Vienna. 39 00:01:50,350 --> 00:01:53,079 And today I'm going to talk about 40 00:01:53,080 --> 00:01:55,359 estrogen bio politics. 41 00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:58,329 So to give you a brief introduction, 42 00:01:58,330 --> 00:02:00,579 I'm an artist first and foremost, but 43 00:02:00,580 --> 00:02:03,219 my methodology is in biohacking 44 00:02:03,220 --> 00:02:06,069 and that's for me to get a familiarity 45 00:02:06,070 --> 00:02:09,309 with my medium, which is hormones. 46 00:02:09,310 --> 00:02:11,379 So I'm also interested in the cultural 47 00:02:11,380 --> 00:02:13,449 discourse as well as 48 00:02:13,450 --> 00:02:15,040 body and gender politics. 49 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:17,360 So. 50 00:02:19,990 --> 00:02:22,449 When we talk about hormone bio politics, 51 00:02:22,450 --> 00:02:24,609 we must first ask, how did 52 00:02:24,610 --> 00:02:27,339 we arrive at this blackbox fact 53 00:02:27,340 --> 00:02:30,039 that estrogen produces a female body 54 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:32,229 and testosterone produces a male body? 55 00:02:33,460 --> 00:02:35,979 Because we didn't just discover hormones 56 00:02:35,980 --> 00:02:38,799 in some lost corner of the planet, 57 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:41,500 we ourselves called them into existence. 58 00:02:43,220 --> 00:02:45,319 In the late eighteen hundreds, there 59 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:47,749 is this concept of organo therapy, 60 00:02:47,750 --> 00:02:49,849 this idea that if you inject the same 61 00:02:49,850 --> 00:02:51,919 organs that as the one that you're trying 62 00:02:51,920 --> 00:02:54,139 to cure, then, 63 00:02:54,140 --> 00:02:56,689 yeah, you would you would cure that organ 64 00:02:56,690 --> 00:02:58,039 by ingesting it. 65 00:02:58,040 --> 00:02:59,689 So there's a scientist named Brown 66 00:02:59,690 --> 00:03:02,089 Saccade that claim that if he 67 00:03:02,090 --> 00:03:04,219 ate the testicles of dogs and 68 00:03:04,220 --> 00:03:05,899 roosters and monkeys, that this would 69 00:03:05,900 --> 00:03:07,849 rejuvenate him of old age 70 00:03:09,110 --> 00:03:11,209 and regain their regain 71 00:03:11,210 --> 00:03:13,460 his vitality and his masculinity. 72 00:03:14,660 --> 00:03:17,689 He called it the medicine of the future 73 00:03:17,690 --> 00:03:19,969 that sounds familiar to any transhumanist 74 00:03:19,970 --> 00:03:20,970 in the room, 75 00:03:22,220 --> 00:03:24,349 but back then, there is no way 76 00:03:24,350 --> 00:03:26,839 to visualize or verify 77 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:28,819 that what they had isolated from these 78 00:03:28,820 --> 00:03:31,229 organs and purified was indeed 79 00:03:31,230 --> 00:03:33,139 estrogen or testosterone. 80 00:03:33,140 --> 00:03:35,269 So what they had to do was rely on these 81 00:03:35,270 --> 00:03:36,649 bio assays. 82 00:03:36,650 --> 00:03:38,929 So basically human and animal test 83 00:03:38,930 --> 00:03:40,999 subjects where, for 84 00:03:41,000 --> 00:03:43,099 example, I'll give you a 85 00:03:43,100 --> 00:03:45,379 story about Eugene Steinback, 86 00:03:45,380 --> 00:03:47,479 who was an Austrian scientist 87 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:49,609 and had his lab in Vienna 88 00:03:49,610 --> 00:03:50,929 amusement park. 89 00:03:50,930 --> 00:03:52,759 And what he would do is perform these 90 00:03:52,760 --> 00:03:55,159 gonad transplants to basically 91 00:03:55,160 --> 00:03:57,349 remove the testicles of 92 00:03:57,350 --> 00:03:59,479 rats or roosters. 93 00:03:59,480 --> 00:04:01,789 And then he would observe, well, 94 00:04:01,790 --> 00:04:04,279 now these rats are acting more feminine. 95 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,799 They're more docile and less aggressive. 96 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:09,259 So it is that the testicle 97 00:04:09,260 --> 00:04:11,239 that contains the male essence, 98 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:12,240 testosterone. 99 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:16,879 So you can see from these studies that 100 00:04:16,880 --> 00:04:18,979 it's a sort of gender fiction 101 00:04:18,980 --> 00:04:21,139 that he's promoting, 102 00:04:21,140 --> 00:04:23,239 that the the notion of gender is 103 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:25,699 already inscribed into the gonads, 104 00:04:25,700 --> 00:04:27,259 into the chemicals and into the 105 00:04:27,260 --> 00:04:28,260 experiments. 106 00:04:30,370 --> 00:04:33,759 So from these experiments 107 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:35,949 came kind of the beginning of 108 00:04:35,950 --> 00:04:38,829 an industry where they would use these, 109 00:04:38,830 --> 00:04:41,769 um, is, uh, 110 00:04:41,770 --> 00:04:44,229 organ concoctions 111 00:04:44,230 --> 00:04:46,689 like, uh, extracts 112 00:04:46,690 --> 00:04:49,209 to rejuvenate men of old age, 113 00:04:49,210 --> 00:04:51,789 to cure homosexuality 114 00:04:51,790 --> 00:04:53,859 and to 115 00:04:53,860 --> 00:04:55,959 basically fix women who are 116 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:58,239 too tall or too masculine and men 117 00:04:58,240 --> 00:04:59,379 who are too feminine. 118 00:05:02,100 --> 00:05:04,259 And to further understand how these 119 00:05:04,260 --> 00:05:06,359 semantic fictions became more 120 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,549 entrenched and normalized, we 121 00:05:08,550 --> 00:05:10,779 have to follow the funding. 122 00:05:10,780 --> 00:05:13,199 So pharmaceutical and chemical 123 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:15,689 companies, they saw a huge profit 124 00:05:15,690 --> 00:05:17,819 in these molecules 125 00:05:17,820 --> 00:05:20,190 and they decided, well, 126 00:05:21,240 --> 00:05:23,549 there needs to be a race to see 127 00:05:23,550 --> 00:05:26,129 who can conquest these hormones, 128 00:05:26,130 --> 00:05:28,289 isolated, source it and market 129 00:05:28,290 --> 00:05:29,400 it to the masses. 130 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:32,759 The marketing aspect was crucial. 131 00:05:33,840 --> 00:05:35,879 For example, the disease depression does 132 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,109 not exist without the synthetic molecule 133 00:05:38,110 --> 00:05:40,169 serotonin, the same way 134 00:05:40,170 --> 00:05:42,659 that clinical masculinity does not exist 135 00:05:42,660 --> 00:05:45,379 without synthetic testosterone. 136 00:05:45,380 --> 00:05:47,719 These dramatic fictions were used to 137 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:50,059 to create diseases that would have 138 00:05:50,060 --> 00:05:51,290 a hormonal cure. 139 00:05:54,290 --> 00:05:56,839 Initially, they saw testicles and ovaries 140 00:05:56,840 --> 00:05:59,359 from animals such as bulls, cows 141 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:01,459 and goats, and even marginalized 142 00:06:01,460 --> 00:06:04,609 people like the poor disenfranchized 143 00:06:04,610 --> 00:06:06,709 and the incarcerated, but soon 144 00:06:06,710 --> 00:06:08,839 they moved on to urine because urine 145 00:06:08,840 --> 00:06:11,089 came in larger quantities. 146 00:06:11,090 --> 00:06:13,399 Thousands of women had had their urine 147 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:15,649 sourced from hospitals and gynecological 148 00:06:15,650 --> 00:06:17,959 psychological clinics, not knowing 149 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:19,399 that they were contributing to big 150 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:20,420 pharmas research. 151 00:06:21,770 --> 00:06:24,559 After women came horses 152 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:27,289 which have to be continuously impregnated 153 00:06:27,290 --> 00:06:29,449 to produce their hormone rich urine. 154 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:33,229 These estrogen's isolated from Uran 155 00:06:33,230 --> 00:06:35,329 are conjugated estrogen's meaning 156 00:06:35,330 --> 00:06:37,069 that they are not potent enough for 157 00:06:37,070 --> 00:06:39,439 gender transition therapy, but enough 158 00:06:39,440 --> 00:06:41,479 to treat symptoms of menopause such as 159 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:43,129 hot flashes. 160 00:06:43,130 --> 00:06:45,619 However, since the 1970s, 161 00:06:45,620 --> 00:06:48,769 recent research has shown that Premarin, 162 00:06:48,770 --> 00:06:51,079 where you see on the slide, has 163 00:06:51,080 --> 00:06:53,419 greatly increased breast and endometrial 164 00:06:53,420 --> 00:06:54,829 cancer in its users. 165 00:06:57,790 --> 00:06:59,529 Then they discovered Dichato, so 166 00:06:59,530 --> 00:07:02,139 Pastorale or Deetz, 167 00:07:02,140 --> 00:07:04,329 it's a form of synthetic estrogen, 168 00:07:04,330 --> 00:07:06,339 which actually came from the 169 00:07:06,340 --> 00:07:08,619 petrochemical industry, not the pharma 170 00:07:08,620 --> 00:07:09,620 industry. 171 00:07:10,280 --> 00:07:11,959 This was the dominant prescription for 172 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,389 pregnant women to prevent miscarriage 173 00:07:14,390 --> 00:07:16,459 until they found a huge rise of 174 00:07:16,460 --> 00:07:18,859 cervical cancers in these women 175 00:07:18,860 --> 00:07:20,599 and also their daughters and 176 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:21,829 granddaughters. 177 00:07:21,830 --> 00:07:24,169 So this left a really terrible legacy 178 00:07:24,170 --> 00:07:26,269 in the US and during its 179 00:07:26,270 --> 00:07:28,519 dominant usage between the 40s 180 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:31,399 and 70s. Then it was finally canceled. 181 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:32,870 And it's off the market now. 182 00:07:34,980 --> 00:07:36,449 And of course, I have to talk about the 183 00:07:36,450 --> 00:07:38,939 pill, which I like to call the American 184 00:07:38,940 --> 00:07:40,989 Lifestyle Drug. 185 00:07:40,990 --> 00:07:43,239 So over 50 percent of women in the U.S. 186 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:45,429 are prescribed on some kind of hormonal 187 00:07:45,430 --> 00:07:47,589 contraceptive pill. 188 00:07:47,590 --> 00:07:49,719 And, you know, we have to 189 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:52,179 remember that this was something that 190 00:07:52,180 --> 00:07:54,579 feminists fought for in 191 00:07:54,580 --> 00:07:56,829 the second wave feminism movement. 192 00:07:56,830 --> 00:07:59,769 It was a symbol for reproductive freedom 193 00:07:59,770 --> 00:08:01,779 until they realized that the pill 194 00:08:01,780 --> 00:08:03,759 actually kills women. 195 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:06,519 It causes cancer, pelvic inflammatory 196 00:08:06,520 --> 00:08:09,309 disease, depression, all kinds of other 197 00:08:09,310 --> 00:08:11,359 horrible side effects. 198 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:13,489 But at the same time, you know, if you 199 00:08:13,490 --> 00:08:15,679 are a woman born in the developing 200 00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:18,019 world and where, 201 00:08:18,020 --> 00:08:19,909 you know, women actually die from having 202 00:08:19,910 --> 00:08:21,979 too many complications from too 203 00:08:21,980 --> 00:08:24,559 many pregnancies, then the pill actually 204 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:26,329 prevents death. 205 00:08:26,330 --> 00:08:28,429 So it really depends on the body that 206 00:08:28,430 --> 00:08:30,919 you're born into, whether the pill saves 207 00:08:30,920 --> 00:08:33,379 lives or kills people. 208 00:08:33,380 --> 00:08:35,959 Either way, I think we can all agree that 209 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:38,119 it's time for a non hormonal 210 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:40,219 contraceptive method and we shouldn't 211 00:08:40,220 --> 00:08:41,808 wait around for Big Pharma to get to 212 00:08:41,809 --> 00:08:42,809 this. 213 00:08:47,790 --> 00:08:50,519 And of course, when ecologists 214 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:52,649 began noticing frogs growing overseas 215 00:08:52,650 --> 00:08:55,049 next to their testicles, the media 216 00:08:55,050 --> 00:08:57,149 decided, OK, well, let's blame the 217 00:08:57,150 --> 00:08:59,189 suburban housewives for peeing their 218 00:08:59,190 --> 00:09:01,319 birth control subscriptions into the 219 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:03,509 water supply until they soon 220 00:09:03,510 --> 00:09:05,609 realized that what's causing 221 00:09:05,610 --> 00:09:08,309 these gonad deformations 222 00:09:08,310 --> 00:09:10,469 was actually coming from atrazine, 223 00:09:10,470 --> 00:09:12,629 a really common pesticide used in 224 00:09:12,630 --> 00:09:14,489 the US in the agro industry. 225 00:09:17,770 --> 00:09:19,959 And a lot of the 226 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:21,849 media. 227 00:09:21,850 --> 00:09:23,979 Also called or even science is called 228 00:09:23,980 --> 00:09:26,139 these frogs, transgender 229 00:09:26,140 --> 00:09:28,479 frogs and the fish, also transgender 230 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:30,819 fish, which I have to say 231 00:09:30,820 --> 00:09:33,339 is, uh, the wrong terminology, 232 00:09:33,340 --> 00:09:36,249 because that's like referring to our 233 00:09:36,250 --> 00:09:38,379 trans friends that they are the 234 00:09:38,380 --> 00:09:40,539 result of some chemical mutation, 235 00:09:40,540 --> 00:09:41,860 which is completely false. 236 00:09:44,610 --> 00:09:47,759 And PCBs are 237 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:49,889 another highly persistent and pervasive 238 00:09:49,890 --> 00:09:52,739 molecule from the petrochemical industry. 239 00:09:52,740 --> 00:09:54,569 And when they invented it, they actually 240 00:09:54,570 --> 00:09:56,939 called it a magic fluid because 241 00:09:56,940 --> 00:09:59,189 it increased the stability and longevity 242 00:09:59,190 --> 00:10:01,319 of everything that it touched. 243 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:03,719 So PCBs, I think, are 244 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:06,749 one of the most pervasive chemicals 245 00:10:06,750 --> 00:10:08,849 that we have in existence. 246 00:10:08,850 --> 00:10:11,429 And after the nineteen 247 00:10:11,430 --> 00:10:14,159 twenty nine economic collapse, 248 00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:15,929 actually, Monsanto took over its 249 00:10:15,930 --> 00:10:16,859 production. 250 00:10:16,860 --> 00:10:19,379 So we think of Monsanto now as an agro 251 00:10:19,380 --> 00:10:21,329 agricultural industry, but actually it 252 00:10:21,330 --> 00:10:23,609 started out as a petrochemical company. 253 00:10:24,690 --> 00:10:27,029 And if you are familiar 254 00:10:27,030 --> 00:10:29,039 with the effects of dioxin or Agent 255 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:31,139 Orange, PCBs have to have 256 00:10:31,140 --> 00:10:32,519 basically the same effects. 257 00:10:35,460 --> 00:10:38,129 And this is the last one 258 00:10:38,130 --> 00:10:41,099 we have the very popular BPA. 259 00:10:41,100 --> 00:10:43,469 And this molecule was 260 00:10:43,470 --> 00:10:45,779 also coming from petrochemical, but 261 00:10:45,780 --> 00:10:48,089 they decided that before 262 00:10:48,090 --> 00:10:50,339 us they wanted to try it on women because 263 00:10:50,340 --> 00:10:52,469 they knew that it had estrogenic 264 00:10:52,470 --> 00:10:53,909 effects. 265 00:10:53,910 --> 00:10:56,489 So since the 1930s, 266 00:10:56,490 --> 00:10:58,529 the industry has known this as has 267 00:10:58,530 --> 00:10:59,789 estrogenic effects. 268 00:10:59,790 --> 00:11:01,679 Yet it's one of the most commonly used 269 00:11:01,680 --> 00:11:04,019 plasticizers in the packaging 270 00:11:04,020 --> 00:11:05,489 industry, the food and packaging 271 00:11:05,490 --> 00:11:06,490 industry. 272 00:11:07,170 --> 00:11:09,239 And you might notice that a lot 273 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:11,489 of your water bottles say BPA free 274 00:11:11,490 --> 00:11:12,839 on them now. 275 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:15,119 Well, they might still 276 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:17,249 contain BAPS, which is just 277 00:11:17,250 --> 00:11:19,379 another version 278 00:11:19,380 --> 00:11:21,539 of BPA, which is just as 279 00:11:21,540 --> 00:11:23,759 toxic, but the companies are not 280 00:11:23,760 --> 00:11:26,069 legally obliged to label it containing 281 00:11:26,070 --> 00:11:27,070 BP's. 282 00:11:29,950 --> 00:11:30,950 So. 283 00:11:32,310 --> 00:11:34,529 Despite all these warnings 284 00:11:34,530 --> 00:11:36,869 about the toxic impacts of these and the 285 00:11:36,870 --> 00:11:39,539 disrupters, all of these Zino Estrogen's 286 00:11:39,540 --> 00:11:41,609 these hormonally active compounds in the 287 00:11:41,610 --> 00:11:43,679 environments, the lobbying 288 00:11:43,680 --> 00:11:45,629 of petrochemical, agricultural and 289 00:11:45,630 --> 00:11:47,909 pharmaceutical industries continues 290 00:11:47,910 --> 00:11:50,369 to influence the regulatory institutions 291 00:11:50,370 --> 00:11:52,509 in favor of their Karplus interests. 292 00:11:53,510 --> 00:11:55,849 I see this as a kind 293 00:11:55,850 --> 00:11:57,949 of molecular colonization 294 00:11:57,950 --> 00:12:00,229 on our bodies and bodies of non-human 295 00:12:00,230 --> 00:12:02,599 species, which also forces 296 00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:04,969 us to rethink our definitions of normal 297 00:12:04,970 --> 00:12:07,279 and natural, our relationships 298 00:12:07,280 --> 00:12:08,899 with our bodies, with the environment, 299 00:12:08,900 --> 00:12:11,269 the environment, and also 300 00:12:11,270 --> 00:12:13,759 how we can face our shared species 301 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,129 vulnerability in this all toxic 302 00:12:16,130 --> 00:12:17,269 alien becoming. 303 00:12:19,780 --> 00:12:22,419 Because to state it bluntly, 304 00:12:22,420 --> 00:12:24,249 these molecules have no respect for 305 00:12:24,250 --> 00:12:26,409 jurisdiction nor concern for 306 00:12:26,410 --> 00:12:27,849 human and environmental health. 307 00:12:27,850 --> 00:12:30,009 I mean, why would they they 308 00:12:30,010 --> 00:12:31,749 go wherever they please, wherever they're 309 00:12:31,750 --> 00:12:32,859 released. 310 00:12:32,860 --> 00:12:35,079 And more often than not, these 311 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:37,149 places are concentrated 312 00:12:37,150 --> 00:12:39,339 and marginalized, disenfranchized 313 00:12:39,340 --> 00:12:41,319 and indigenous communities. 314 00:12:41,320 --> 00:12:43,509 There are several cases of toxic 315 00:12:43,510 --> 00:12:45,639 dumping happening in the 316 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:47,919 US, mostly on 317 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:50,110 Native American reservations and so on. 318 00:12:52,420 --> 00:12:54,159 So when we talk about 319 00:12:55,390 --> 00:12:57,279 the non-human and embracing the 320 00:12:57,280 --> 00:12:59,619 non-human, we also can't forget 321 00:12:59,620 --> 00:13:01,929 those bodies, which we already treat 322 00:13:01,930 --> 00:13:02,950 as non-human. 323 00:13:04,570 --> 00:13:06,609 Who I mean, they live very precarious 324 00:13:06,610 --> 00:13:08,769 lives, so the effects 325 00:13:08,770 --> 00:13:10,989 of these and the Quran disrupting 326 00:13:10,990 --> 00:13:13,689 molecules, they range from obesity 327 00:13:13,690 --> 00:13:16,689 to lower IQ to early onset puberty, 328 00:13:16,690 --> 00:13:18,699 cervical and testicular cancers. 329 00:13:18,700 --> 00:13:20,949 And it's important to note that it's 330 00:13:20,950 --> 00:13:23,679 not just the reproductive effects 331 00:13:23,680 --> 00:13:25,749 that the reproductive organs that are 332 00:13:25,750 --> 00:13:27,939 affected by these molecules. 333 00:13:27,940 --> 00:13:29,679 We have just general I mean, these 334 00:13:29,680 --> 00:13:31,839 molecules are affecting our entire 335 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:33,939 hormonal stability that goes 336 00:13:33,940 --> 00:13:36,159 from the neurological centers 337 00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,619 and to the normal metabolism 338 00:13:38,620 --> 00:13:39,620 of the body. 339 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:43,269 However, it's it is 340 00:13:43,270 --> 00:13:45,069 the reproductive effects that we tend to 341 00:13:45,070 --> 00:13:47,139 focus on, especially in 342 00:13:47,140 --> 00:13:48,849 public discourse, and I'm going to go 343 00:13:48,850 --> 00:13:50,369 back to that. 344 00:13:50,370 --> 00:13:52,229 A little bit later. 345 00:13:52,230 --> 00:13:54,119 So what can we do about this? 346 00:13:55,260 --> 00:13:57,359 So I started to work on this 347 00:13:57,360 --> 00:13:59,489 project called Open Source Estragon 348 00:13:59,490 --> 00:14:02,189 about two and a half, three years ago, 349 00:14:02,190 --> 00:14:04,499 and it's a collaborative investigative 350 00:14:04,500 --> 00:14:06,749 project seeking to demonstrate 351 00:14:06,750 --> 00:14:08,939 the various entrenched ways that 352 00:14:08,940 --> 00:14:11,309 hormone's have colonized every aspect 353 00:14:11,310 --> 00:14:13,019 of our being. 354 00:14:13,020 --> 00:14:15,149 The project. It's open source in the 355 00:14:15,150 --> 00:14:17,429 sense that the protocols generated 356 00:14:17,430 --> 00:14:19,679 are shareable, hackable and 357 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:20,940 constantly improved on. 358 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:24,839 And another sense that it's open source 359 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:26,999 is the fact that the Xiuzhen is all 360 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:27,989 around us. 361 00:14:27,990 --> 00:14:30,929 It's all pervasive, it's ubiquitous, 362 00:14:30,930 --> 00:14:32,999 and in a sense, it's available 363 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:35,279 for us to hack and to collaborate 364 00:14:35,280 --> 00:14:38,009 with and to refigure new subjectivities. 365 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:43,829 The project takes a lot of influence from 366 00:14:43,830 --> 00:14:45,659 Tactical, our collective critical art 367 00:14:45,660 --> 00:14:47,969 ensemble, and the concept of fuzzy 368 00:14:47,970 --> 00:14:50,069 biological sabotage, 369 00:14:50,070 --> 00:14:52,589 the idea that organisms could be hacked 370 00:14:52,590 --> 00:14:54,779 and reversed and manipulated and used for 371 00:14:54,780 --> 00:14:55,919 social resistance. 372 00:14:57,340 --> 00:14:59,529 The project is also heavily influenced 373 00:14:59,530 --> 00:15:02,919 by cyber feminist collective sub rosa 374 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:05,289 and this picture, their performance 375 00:15:05,290 --> 00:15:07,359 hosting the world's first 376 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:09,939 woman friendly expo on Advanced 377 00:15:09,940 --> 00:15:13,119 Reproductive Technologies A.R.T. 378 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:16,059 it was a way to perform science publicly 379 00:15:16,060 --> 00:15:18,159 mimicking the language and rhetoric used 380 00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:20,319 to capitalize and commodify 381 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:22,120 female marginalized bodies. 382 00:15:24,700 --> 00:15:27,129 So open source Estragon, 383 00:15:27,130 --> 00:15:29,289 we started with a really simple question, 384 00:15:29,290 --> 00:15:31,359 which was what if it was possible to 385 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:33,129 make a decision in the kitchen? 386 00:15:34,460 --> 00:15:36,679 This question opened up more questions 387 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:38,329 as to whose bodies are currently 388 00:15:38,330 --> 00:15:40,639 affected, who's currently controlling 389 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,339 its distribution, and whether the ethics 390 00:15:43,340 --> 00:15:45,229 behind self administering self 391 00:15:45,230 --> 00:15:47,299 synthesized hormones that 392 00:15:47,300 --> 00:15:49,099 haven't gone through FDA approval or 393 00:15:49,100 --> 00:15:50,839 clinical trials. 394 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:52,999 What are people willing to risk to 395 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:54,880 gain greater body autonomy? 396 00:15:57,810 --> 00:15:59,909 We didn't want to underestimate the 397 00:15:59,910 --> 00:16:02,129 power of speculative fiction 398 00:16:02,130 --> 00:16:04,319 using the format of a fictional cooking 399 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:06,479 show which is called Housewives Making 400 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:07,529 Drugs. 401 00:16:07,530 --> 00:16:09,299 Not only are we demystifying the 402 00:16:09,300 --> 00:16:11,539 scientific protocol of hacking Estragon 403 00:16:11,540 --> 00:16:13,859 and the DIY kitchen setting, 404 00:16:13,860 --> 00:16:15,779 it's also presented as a practice of 405 00:16:15,780 --> 00:16:17,849 decolonization, a way to 406 00:16:17,850 --> 00:16:20,369 unravel how bodies can be managed, 407 00:16:20,370 --> 00:16:23,039 disciplined and pathologies 408 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:25,139 and then say, well, here's a way 409 00:16:25,140 --> 00:16:26,759 we can engineer our own form of 410 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:29,129 resistance. Sharing Xiuzhen recipes 411 00:16:29,130 --> 00:16:30,130 in the kitchen. 412 00:16:32,010 --> 00:16:34,229 This is a 10 minute film, Housewives 413 00:16:34,230 --> 00:16:36,719 Making Drugs, starring two amazing 414 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:38,759 trans performers, Jade Phenix and Jade 415 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:39,760 Renegade. 416 00:16:41,380 --> 00:16:43,809 Now, I want to switch gears 417 00:16:43,810 --> 00:16:45,939 and tell you more about how I got 418 00:16:45,940 --> 00:16:48,339 to these recipes in the first place 419 00:16:48,340 --> 00:16:51,129 to get into a bit of biohacking 420 00:16:51,130 --> 00:16:53,169 or what I like to call Estragon geeking 421 00:16:53,170 --> 00:16:54,170 freak science. 422 00:16:55,390 --> 00:16:57,399 So the first protocol that I started 423 00:16:57,400 --> 00:16:59,589 exploring was a low cost 424 00:16:59,590 --> 00:17:02,259 way to detect estrogen. 425 00:17:02,260 --> 00:17:04,689 So I started 426 00:17:04,690 --> 00:17:07,299 exploring transgenic yeast, biosensors. 427 00:17:08,530 --> 00:17:10,989 By the way, the text in the yellow is 428 00:17:10,990 --> 00:17:12,969 a shout out to all the people I worked 429 00:17:12,970 --> 00:17:15,249 with because Xiuzhen geeking 430 00:17:15,250 --> 00:17:17,379 freak science is not something you can or 431 00:17:17,380 --> 00:17:18,879 should do by yourself. 432 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:20,289 It's more fun with friends. 433 00:17:21,579 --> 00:17:24,098 So with these E IV inserted 434 00:17:24,099 --> 00:17:26,318 plasma, a plasma containing human 435 00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:28,539 estrogen receptor, and 436 00:17:28,540 --> 00:17:30,699 this allows the yeast to produce 437 00:17:30,700 --> 00:17:32,829 a yellow molecule when it comes in 438 00:17:32,830 --> 00:17:35,019 contact with any kind of estrogenic 439 00:17:35,020 --> 00:17:37,389 molecule. So any molecule that binds 440 00:17:37,390 --> 00:17:40,369 to the estrogen receptor. 441 00:17:40,370 --> 00:17:42,319 And keep in mind, this is a receptor 442 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:44,509 that's highly conserved among all animal 443 00:17:44,510 --> 00:17:46,759 taxa and it has a super 444 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:49,219 long, ancient evolutionary 445 00:17:49,220 --> 00:17:50,119 history. 446 00:17:50,120 --> 00:17:51,589 This estrogen receptor. 447 00:17:51,590 --> 00:17:54,139 And so that's why we have the frogs 448 00:17:54,140 --> 00:17:56,059 and the fish and the microbes and 449 00:17:56,060 --> 00:17:58,249 everything's being affected by these 450 00:17:58,250 --> 00:17:59,390 zino molecules. 451 00:18:00,940 --> 00:18:03,099 So this is biosensors, 452 00:18:03,100 --> 00:18:04,599 they actually have amazingly high 453 00:18:04,600 --> 00:18:06,669 sensitivity compared to traditional 454 00:18:06,670 --> 00:18:08,799 laboratory machines like geochemists 455 00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:10,299 or else CM's. 456 00:18:10,300 --> 00:18:12,279 However, these are machines that no 457 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:14,799 citizen really has like 458 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:16,749 any access to because they're huge and 459 00:18:16,750 --> 00:18:19,089 they cost tens of thousands of dollars. 460 00:18:20,810 --> 00:18:23,239 And more importantly, 461 00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:25,519 the east biosensors are able 462 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:27,769 to detect compounds that we don't 463 00:18:27,770 --> 00:18:29,289 even know are estrogenic yet. 464 00:18:31,750 --> 00:18:34,179 The next protocol is a DIY solid 465 00:18:34,180 --> 00:18:35,559 phase extraction. 466 00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:38,079 So this is a method I like to use for 467 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:40,599 large bodies of water like rivers 468 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:42,729 or oceans or even tap 469 00:18:42,730 --> 00:18:44,949 water. And I've also used 470 00:18:44,950 --> 00:18:48,189 I've tested holy water from churches. 471 00:18:48,190 --> 00:18:50,319 And so basically the the 472 00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:52,719 molecules are existing and very 473 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:54,279 dilute concentrations. 474 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:56,469 So you need a way to concentrate that. 475 00:18:56,470 --> 00:18:59,049 And this process is using a peristaltic 476 00:18:59,050 --> 00:19:00,849 pump system. 477 00:19:00,850 --> 00:19:02,979 And when you combine this system with 478 00:19:02,980 --> 00:19:05,319 the yeast biosensors, then it's a process 479 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:07,419 I like to call river gynecology 480 00:19:07,420 --> 00:19:09,609 because you're basically diagnosing the 481 00:19:09,610 --> 00:19:11,859 river for any pollutants 482 00:19:11,860 --> 00:19:13,989 or toxic compounds the same way that 483 00:19:13,990 --> 00:19:15,430 you would diagnose your own body. 484 00:19:17,950 --> 00:19:20,409 The next one is a 485 00:19:20,410 --> 00:19:22,689 protocol I like to use for urine, 486 00:19:22,690 --> 00:19:25,179 so this is for extracting the estrogens 487 00:19:25,180 --> 00:19:26,379 that we pee out. 488 00:19:26,380 --> 00:19:29,079 And keep in mind, these estrogens 489 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:31,239 are they're conjugated, 490 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:32,859 which means that they're in an inactive 491 00:19:32,860 --> 00:19:34,009 form. 492 00:19:34,010 --> 00:19:36,099 And so 493 00:19:36,100 --> 00:19:37,929 it's not something I would recommend for 494 00:19:37,930 --> 00:19:41,109 any kind of gender transition therapy. 495 00:19:41,110 --> 00:19:42,909 But if you go back to the story of 496 00:19:42,910 --> 00:19:45,009 Premarin and the pregnant horses, 497 00:19:45,010 --> 00:19:47,109 it is a compound that they used 498 00:19:47,110 --> 00:19:49,329 to use for menopausal 499 00:19:49,330 --> 00:19:50,330 symptoms. 500 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,569 So the protocol is using household 501 00:19:53,570 --> 00:19:55,909 materials like silica gel, 502 00:19:55,910 --> 00:19:58,309 cigaret filters and methanol 503 00:19:58,310 --> 00:20:00,859 kind of household, and 504 00:20:00,860 --> 00:20:03,099 it also uses a glass bottle. 505 00:20:03,100 --> 00:20:05,179 So you cut the glass bottle and that 506 00:20:05,180 --> 00:20:07,339 substitutes for the expensive laboratory 507 00:20:07,340 --> 00:20:08,340 columns. 508 00:20:10,230 --> 00:20:12,389 And lastly, I've been exploring 509 00:20:12,390 --> 00:20:15,149 a new trajectory with artist Ryan Hammond 510 00:20:15,150 --> 00:20:17,519 on a species of white rot 511 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:19,679 fungus which are able to break 512 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,569 down toxicities as a form of 513 00:20:21,570 --> 00:20:22,800 bioremediation. 514 00:20:23,820 --> 00:20:26,519 The fungus also has incredible medicinal 515 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:28,439 anticancer anti terror ambersons 516 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,809 properties, which if you're a person 517 00:20:30,810 --> 00:20:32,969 on HRT or birth control 518 00:20:32,970 --> 00:20:35,069 pills, the fungus would really help with 519 00:20:35,070 --> 00:20:36,900 that. So it's pretty interesting. 520 00:20:39,260 --> 00:20:41,719 So much of my practice is 521 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,479 based in workshop ology, 522 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:46,849 workshopping with the public and people 523 00:20:46,850 --> 00:20:49,069 who have no idea what is biohacking 524 00:20:49,070 --> 00:20:50,659 or what or whether Estrogen's or any of 525 00:20:50,660 --> 00:20:51,799 this stuff. 526 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:53,899 And I do it as a form of 527 00:20:53,900 --> 00:20:56,179 public amateurism, which is a phrase 528 00:20:56,180 --> 00:20:58,099 I'm borrowing from critical art ensemble 529 00:20:58,100 --> 00:21:00,739 and Sabratha to mean learning 530 00:21:00,740 --> 00:21:03,079 and failing together in the public 531 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:05,989 as a way to learn without any hierarchies 532 00:21:05,990 --> 00:21:08,269 of expert or layperson, and 533 00:21:08,270 --> 00:21:10,849 also, most importantly, demystify 534 00:21:10,850 --> 00:21:13,009 these scientific protocols and rhetoric. 535 00:21:15,460 --> 00:21:17,379 I also collaborate with a collective 536 00:21:17,380 --> 00:21:19,929 called The Aliens in Green, which is 537 00:21:19,930 --> 00:21:21,999 an investigative laboratory 538 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,379 and tactical theater group. 539 00:21:24,380 --> 00:21:26,959 Which tried which tries to 540 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,599 reveal the alien agents of anthropogenic 541 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:32,059 zino power, in other words, 542 00:21:32,060 --> 00:21:33,800 these toxic estrogen's 543 00:21:35,330 --> 00:21:37,519 we use media communication, open 544 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:39,319 science, philosophy and speculative 545 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:41,779 fiction in order to generate critical 546 00:21:41,780 --> 00:21:43,879 discourse and interventions in the 547 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:45,589 public sphere. 548 00:21:45,590 --> 00:21:47,779 Our workshops tend to last six 549 00:21:47,780 --> 00:21:50,419 hours long because they're so intensive 550 00:21:50,420 --> 00:21:52,459 and highly orchestrated. 551 00:21:52,460 --> 00:21:54,679 We actually abduct the participants into 552 00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:56,779 a performance without them even knowing 553 00:21:56,780 --> 00:21:57,780 it. 554 00:21:59,450 --> 00:22:01,669 One of the discursive exercises 555 00:22:01,670 --> 00:22:03,979 we tried to do is to take 556 00:22:03,980 --> 00:22:06,019 all the effects of Anacreon disrupters 557 00:22:06,020 --> 00:22:08,149 like obesity, autism, low 558 00:22:08,150 --> 00:22:10,279 sperm count, and we asked 559 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:12,259 the participants to place them into one 560 00:22:12,260 --> 00:22:14,599 of two categories is a biological 561 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,089 suffering or ideological 562 00:22:17,090 --> 00:22:19,429 suffering, meaning like you actually 563 00:22:19,430 --> 00:22:21,769 experience real pain 564 00:22:21,770 --> 00:22:24,719 from these effects, these toxic effects, 565 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:26,989 or is it more a result 566 00:22:26,990 --> 00:22:29,839 of society's binary 567 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:31,939 hetero normative system 568 00:22:31,940 --> 00:22:34,099 that is disciplining you 569 00:22:34,100 --> 00:22:36,169 or acting as a 570 00:22:36,170 --> 00:22:38,299 form of bio surveillance on you, on 571 00:22:38,300 --> 00:22:39,300 your body? 572 00:22:42,140 --> 00:22:44,269 Another project that I've been working 573 00:22:44,270 --> 00:22:46,369 on, this is where my my practice is 574 00:22:46,370 --> 00:22:48,679 going into more performance territory is 575 00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:51,739 called the Molecular Queering Agency, 576 00:22:51,740 --> 00:22:53,659 which is a live, participatory, 577 00:22:53,660 --> 00:22:56,509 participatory performance involving 578 00:22:56,510 --> 00:22:58,639 worshiping urine and using these 579 00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:00,739 oxygen masks that are 580 00:23:00,740 --> 00:23:03,469 filled with hormones for you to inhale. 581 00:23:03,470 --> 00:23:05,450 And also an audio visual projection. 582 00:23:06,590 --> 00:23:09,349 This is a fictional service 583 00:23:09,350 --> 00:23:11,749 offered by unknown and known 584 00:23:11,750 --> 00:23:13,879 molecular agents that have colonized the 585 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:14,899 planet. 586 00:23:14,900 --> 00:23:17,659 The agency gently guides participants 587 00:23:17,660 --> 00:23:19,819 through the process of queering 588 00:23:19,820 --> 00:23:21,949 as they're as they're asked to offer 589 00:23:21,950 --> 00:23:23,899 up their own urine for the hormones to be 590 00:23:23,900 --> 00:23:25,339 extracted. 591 00:23:25,340 --> 00:23:27,529 So in the picture there, they're 592 00:23:27,530 --> 00:23:29,179 inhaling these hormones and then those 593 00:23:29,180 --> 00:23:31,339 hormones are actually extracted from 594 00:23:31,340 --> 00:23:32,869 previous participants. 595 00:23:32,870 --> 00:23:35,119 So I've created this kind of like hormone 596 00:23:35,120 --> 00:23:37,399 colonizing cycle 597 00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,589 each time I do this performance. 598 00:23:39,590 --> 00:23:41,659 And we worship the urine 599 00:23:41,660 --> 00:23:43,849 because it's a symbol of this 600 00:23:43,850 --> 00:23:45,319 disobedient liquid. 601 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:47,179 It contains not just the natural 602 00:23:47,180 --> 00:23:49,369 estrogens that we make in our bodies, 603 00:23:49,370 --> 00:23:51,439 but it also tells us how much exposure 604 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:53,959 we've had to zino 605 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:54,960 estrogens. 606 00:23:56,740 --> 00:23:58,839 So, I mean, it's a 607 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,059 it's a super scary and paralyzing 608 00:24:01,060 --> 00:24:04,059 topic, you know, this idea that we're all 609 00:24:04,060 --> 00:24:06,489 basically mutating, but then 610 00:24:06,490 --> 00:24:08,679 this agency is trying to encourage 611 00:24:08,680 --> 00:24:11,019 that this is a collective mutagenesis, 612 00:24:11,020 --> 00:24:13,119 that we're doing this all together and 613 00:24:13,120 --> 00:24:14,980 we can embrace the horror together. 614 00:24:18,030 --> 00:24:20,129 So this is a three step process for 615 00:24:20,130 --> 00:24:22,829 living in an increasingly queer world. 616 00:24:22,830 --> 00:24:25,589 So the first step is toxicities. 617 00:24:25,590 --> 00:24:27,659 You live in an alien landscape 618 00:24:27,660 --> 00:24:30,089 filled with polluted 619 00:24:30,090 --> 00:24:32,429 by petrochemical, agricultural 620 00:24:32,430 --> 00:24:34,889 and pharmaceutical industries. 621 00:24:34,890 --> 00:24:36,419 Step two samosas. 622 00:24:36,420 --> 00:24:39,029 You're already alien with plastics 623 00:24:39,030 --> 00:24:41,609 in your urine, in your blood, 624 00:24:41,610 --> 00:24:43,289 in your children. 625 00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:46,919 And step three, subjectivities. 626 00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:48,689 You want to be more alien than you 627 00:24:48,690 --> 00:24:49,690 already are. 628 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,139 Because what does it actually mean to be 629 00:24:54,140 --> 00:24:56,239 alien or to be queer or 630 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:57,859 to be outside what is socially or 631 00:24:57,860 --> 00:24:59,629 medically accepted? 632 00:24:59,630 --> 00:25:00,799 So I found this paper. 633 00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,019 It's actually a scientific publication 634 00:25:03,020 --> 00:25:05,119 where they hybridize two species 635 00:25:05,120 --> 00:25:06,019 of fish. 636 00:25:06,020 --> 00:25:08,629 And the result was a hermaphrodite, 637 00:25:08,630 --> 00:25:10,999 which they called a hopeful monster, 638 00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:12,979 which is really interesting terminology 639 00:25:12,980 --> 00:25:14,599 for a scientific paper. 640 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,639 But it also made me think, well, why 641 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:18,469 can't we also be considered hopeful 642 00:25:18,470 --> 00:25:19,470 monsters? 643 00:25:20,910 --> 00:25:22,649 Because without a doubt, like not only 644 00:25:22,650 --> 00:25:24,839 our physical bodies being disrupted, 645 00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:26,999 but also our binary notions of 646 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,849 male and female of binary genders, 647 00:25:29,850 --> 00:25:32,039 and so when we talk about difference and 648 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:34,649 disruption and disobedience, 649 00:25:34,650 --> 00:25:36,839 let's not also forget those bodies that 650 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:38,939 are social that society 651 00:25:38,940 --> 00:25:41,129 already calls disobedient, like 652 00:25:41,130 --> 00:25:43,919 hermaphrodite bodies, intersex bodies 653 00:25:43,920 --> 00:25:46,049 and their bodies are often medicalise 654 00:25:46,050 --> 00:25:48,779 to fit our notions of normal and natural 655 00:25:48,780 --> 00:25:50,039 and hetero normative. 656 00:25:51,130 --> 00:25:53,469 So like their bodies and also 657 00:25:53,470 --> 00:25:55,629 trans bodies that aren't performing 658 00:25:55,630 --> 00:25:57,129 socially sanctioned heroin or 659 00:25:57,130 --> 00:25:59,679 heteronormativity, they live precarious 660 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:00,680 lives. 661 00:26:01,210 --> 00:26:02,919 And at the same time, you could argue 662 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:04,779 that we we all have an endocrine 663 00:26:04,780 --> 00:26:05,949 disrupted body. 664 00:26:05,950 --> 00:26:08,349 I mean, if they find PCBs in the deepest 665 00:26:08,350 --> 00:26:10,059 parts of the ocean, in the Marianas 666 00:26:10,060 --> 00:26:11,919 Trench, they find PCBs. 667 00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:13,599 So there's nobody out there that hasn't 668 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:15,789 been exposed by these toxic 669 00:26:15,790 --> 00:26:16,790 molecules. 670 00:26:18,940 --> 00:26:21,459 There is a study done in Sweden 671 00:26:21,460 --> 00:26:23,719 linking the 672 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,379 exposure of plastics in pregnant women 673 00:26:26,380 --> 00:26:28,119 to the distance between the anus and the 674 00:26:28,120 --> 00:26:30,519 genitals and is actually getting smaller 675 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:31,899 and smaller. 676 00:26:31,900 --> 00:26:33,999 And so you can see that 677 00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,279 we're all being chemically altered, 678 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,529 physiologically altered. 679 00:26:38,530 --> 00:26:40,359 But to me, this I'm bringing this up 680 00:26:40,360 --> 00:26:42,309 because it's kind of an interesting case 681 00:26:42,310 --> 00:26:44,859 where it seems to be more of a cosmetic 682 00:26:44,860 --> 00:26:47,109 alteration because there is no negative 683 00:26:47,110 --> 00:26:49,809 health effect of having a shorter, 684 00:26:49,810 --> 00:26:51,309 anogenital distance. 685 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:56,009 Maybe more transfer of bacteria, 686 00:26:56,010 --> 00:26:57,659 but actually has a really beautiful 687 00:26:57,660 --> 00:27:00,719 symbolism because like the genitals, 688 00:27:00,720 --> 00:27:02,789 which are the most gendered part of the 689 00:27:02,790 --> 00:27:04,859 body, it's like they're trying 690 00:27:04,860 --> 00:27:07,739 to reach the most non gendered 691 00:27:07,740 --> 00:27:09,509 universal part of the body, which is the 692 00:27:09,510 --> 00:27:11,369 anus. Like everyone has an anus. 693 00:27:13,350 --> 00:27:15,539 But anyway, I 694 00:27:15,540 --> 00:27:17,699 think there's way too much emphasis 695 00:27:17,700 --> 00:27:20,159 being put on the genitals to determine 696 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:21,329 sex and gender. 697 00:27:21,330 --> 00:27:23,969 Right. We know so much from evidence 698 00:27:23,970 --> 00:27:26,129 that this chart that you see 699 00:27:26,130 --> 00:27:28,229 on the screen is a social 700 00:27:28,230 --> 00:27:30,899 somatic fiction that discriminates 701 00:27:30,900 --> 00:27:32,700 against non binary bodies. 702 00:27:34,730 --> 00:27:36,619 And we also have to pay attention when we 703 00:27:36,620 --> 00:27:38,509 talk about endocrine disruption or these 704 00:27:38,510 --> 00:27:40,579 toxic molecules, 705 00:27:40,580 --> 00:27:42,739 it's so easy to slip back 706 00:27:42,740 --> 00:27:45,049 into transphobia, homophobic, 707 00:27:45,050 --> 00:27:47,149 even xenophobic discourse. 708 00:27:47,150 --> 00:27:49,729 I came across this blog post that said, 709 00:27:49,730 --> 00:27:51,499 well, I don't think it's right that the 710 00:27:51,500 --> 00:27:53,299 government is putting birth control pills 711 00:27:53,300 --> 00:27:55,009 in the water supply. 712 00:27:55,010 --> 00:27:56,839 It's making all the men gay. 713 00:27:56,840 --> 00:27:58,909 And we need both male and females 714 00:27:58,910 --> 00:28:01,219 to reproduce the human species 715 00:28:01,220 --> 00:28:03,649 and say, well, I think there's a more 716 00:28:03,650 --> 00:28:05,869 urgent reasons that you should be angry 717 00:28:05,870 --> 00:28:07,640 that there's all these 718 00:28:08,690 --> 00:28:10,879 pollutants in the water supply side 719 00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:12,140 from turning Mangay. 720 00:28:13,610 --> 00:28:15,979 So I just want to return back to plastics 721 00:28:15,980 --> 00:28:17,630 and tease apart the irony a bit. 722 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,289 There's a really great writer named 723 00:28:21,290 --> 00:28:23,479 Heather Davies and she writes about 724 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:25,639 how we're living in this plastic 725 00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:27,679 sphere, this plasticine. 726 00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:30,049 And in a way, the plastic 727 00:28:30,050 --> 00:28:32,269 molecules are our progeny. 728 00:28:32,270 --> 00:28:33,679 They're like our children. 729 00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,869 They're going to live long past, 730 00:28:35,870 --> 00:28:37,669 you know, after we die, they're going to 731 00:28:37,670 --> 00:28:40,189 exist and persist 732 00:28:40,190 --> 00:28:42,319 and create this kind 733 00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:44,899 of geologic indigestion 734 00:28:44,900 --> 00:28:45,900 and the planet. 735 00:28:47,390 --> 00:28:49,519 And so there's no way to 736 00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:52,579 escape this all pervasive toxicity 737 00:28:52,580 --> 00:28:54,859 and it's queering potential. 738 00:28:54,860 --> 00:28:57,439 And so what does that mean for 739 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,139 people who identify as queer now? 740 00:29:00,140 --> 00:29:02,599 I mean, are you are we saying that 741 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:04,999 our queer kin have no future 742 00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:06,589 in this toxic landscape? 743 00:29:08,750 --> 00:29:10,849 And I'd like to think about our bodies 744 00:29:10,850 --> 00:29:12,649 as just, you know, we're all bodies in 745 00:29:12,650 --> 00:29:15,139 flux. You know, we're defined 746 00:29:15,140 --> 00:29:17,329 by our relations with molecules, with 747 00:29:17,330 --> 00:29:19,729 matter in our shared semiotic 748 00:29:19,730 --> 00:29:22,099 sphere. And when I say semiotic sphere, 749 00:29:22,100 --> 00:29:24,049 the semillas sphere, I mean that all 750 00:29:24,050 --> 00:29:26,389 these molecules that are communicating 751 00:29:26,390 --> 00:29:28,729 to us, that communicate to 752 00:29:28,730 --> 00:29:30,919 all other living beings on the planet as 753 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:32,269 well. 754 00:29:32,270 --> 00:29:34,399 And so we're all glitching 755 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:36,710 each other and we're glitching together. 756 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:42,719 The question we have to ask ourselves is, 757 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,969 can we reframe toxicity 758 00:29:44,970 --> 00:29:47,039 without reinforcing a standard of 759 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:48,040 purity? 760 00:29:48,870 --> 00:29:50,969 What that rather than rather than 761 00:29:50,970 --> 00:29:53,429 affirming the cultural panic 762 00:29:53,430 --> 00:29:55,559 through eco conservationist, 763 00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,839 eco hetero normative discourse, 764 00:29:57,840 --> 00:29:59,909 can we shift from toxic toxic 765 00:29:59,910 --> 00:30:02,249 shame to toxic embrace? 766 00:30:02,250 --> 00:30:04,319 Can we create a discourse that 767 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,449 can emancipate us? 768 00:30:06,450 --> 00:30:08,399 Because what's at stake now more than 769 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,819 ever is the issue of body sovereignty, 770 00:30:11,820 --> 00:30:13,979 how bodies can be stolen through 771 00:30:13,980 --> 00:30:16,079 hormonal technologies and residues 772 00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:17,970 of Karplus industrialization. 773 00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:23,719 So I'm going to end here on a six 774 00:30:23,720 --> 00:30:25,849 point plan written under the 775 00:30:25,850 --> 00:30:28,279 Open Source Exclusion Project 776 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:29,839 that's actually modeled after the 777 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:32,239 transgenic cultural production plan 778 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:34,459 of critical art ensemble. 779 00:30:34,460 --> 00:30:36,169 I'm not going to read all of this, but I 780 00:30:36,170 --> 00:30:38,269 just want to emphasize the last point. 781 00:30:38,270 --> 00:30:40,639 Number six considered 782 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:43,129 a micro performative of hormones 783 00:30:43,130 --> 00:30:45,589 as an essential power of not only 784 00:30:45,590 --> 00:30:47,779 molecular colonization, but of molecular 785 00:30:47,780 --> 00:30:50,659 collaboration, because these molecules, 786 00:30:50,660 --> 00:30:52,849 they they live with us, among 787 00:30:52,850 --> 00:30:55,249 us and between us. 788 00:30:55,250 --> 00:30:58,219 And they collaborate on 789 00:30:58,220 --> 00:31:00,169 they collaborate with us to produce who 790 00:31:00,170 --> 00:31:01,459 we are. 791 00:31:01,460 --> 00:31:03,829 And we have to consider 792 00:31:03,830 --> 00:31:05,239 the word disruption as well. 793 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:07,309 Like disruption to what exactly? 794 00:31:07,310 --> 00:31:10,249 Disruption to our hetero normative 795 00:31:10,250 --> 00:31:11,249 strictures. 796 00:31:11,250 --> 00:31:12,529 Well, I think that's a good thing. 797 00:31:12,530 --> 00:31:14,629 It's making us reevaluate 798 00:31:14,630 --> 00:31:16,849 our notions of male 799 00:31:16,850 --> 00:31:18,979 and female categories. 800 00:31:18,980 --> 00:31:20,720 So, yeah, that's it. 801 00:31:29,570 --> 00:31:30,900 Thank you very much. Great talk. 802 00:31:31,940 --> 00:31:34,129 So we have a lot of time 803 00:31:34,130 --> 00:31:35,130 left. 804 00:31:35,910 --> 00:31:37,579 We'll do some Q&A. 805 00:31:37,580 --> 00:31:39,469 So if you have questions, we have 806 00:31:39,470 --> 00:31:41,689 microphones and the whole hall just 807 00:31:41,690 --> 00:31:43,819 line up behind the mikes and you'll 808 00:31:43,820 --> 00:31:44,820 go through. 809 00:31:48,550 --> 00:31:51,569 We will just start with two. 810 00:31:51,570 --> 00:31:53,249 Hi, thank you for your talk. 811 00:31:53,250 --> 00:31:55,199 I was wondering if you could give more 812 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:57,809 details on this topic of 813 00:31:57,810 --> 00:32:00,419 the fungi that you that you made 814 00:32:00,420 --> 00:32:02,609 helping with HRT, because 815 00:32:02,610 --> 00:32:05,069 I think this is very relevant to many 816 00:32:05,070 --> 00:32:06,239 trans people. 817 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:09,579 And, yeah, I was wondering in general, 818 00:32:09,580 --> 00:32:11,849 like the whole project 819 00:32:11,850 --> 00:32:14,099 that you explained, folks 820 00:32:14,100 --> 00:32:16,199 seemed to focus more on, like the 821 00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:17,909 global kind of effects. 822 00:32:17,910 --> 00:32:19,859 But I was wondering a bit more about, you 823 00:32:19,860 --> 00:32:22,079 know, like the personal issue that 824 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,809 that this could help with for sure. 825 00:32:24,810 --> 00:32:26,999 So the the 826 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:29,159 project exploring fungi, 827 00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:31,859 it started really recently, actually, and 828 00:32:31,860 --> 00:32:34,079 we just started exploring its 829 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,329 its properties and we found 830 00:32:36,330 --> 00:32:38,579 out we found all these scientific papers 831 00:32:38,580 --> 00:32:40,829 that it was using the fungus 832 00:32:40,830 --> 00:32:43,109 to make tea and then to combine that with 833 00:32:43,110 --> 00:32:45,899 cervical cancer therapy like chemotherapy 834 00:32:45,900 --> 00:32:47,759 and then and also prevents against 835 00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:50,489 thrombosis, which is, you know, this 836 00:32:50,490 --> 00:32:52,379 this blood clot that happens very 837 00:32:52,380 --> 00:32:53,279 frequently. 838 00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:55,439 And it could be very serious to your 839 00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:56,789 health. 840 00:32:56,790 --> 00:32:58,889 And we realized that these are 841 00:32:58,890 --> 00:33:00,869 also symptoms that are common, you know, 842 00:33:00,870 --> 00:33:02,789 if you're taking like birth control pills 843 00:33:02,790 --> 00:33:04,679 or some kind of HRT. 844 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:06,719 So a lot of these papers that are coming 845 00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:09,569 from Korea and Japan, and they 846 00:33:09,570 --> 00:33:11,819 it's basically like 847 00:33:11,820 --> 00:33:14,189 they it's basically making tea, 848 00:33:14,190 --> 00:33:15,809 you know. But then the way you describe 849 00:33:15,810 --> 00:33:17,729 it in the paper is like really scientific 850 00:33:17,730 --> 00:33:19,309 and boil it at this temperature, blah, 851 00:33:19,310 --> 00:33:19,679 blah, blah. 852 00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:21,689 But you're just you're just soaking it in 853 00:33:21,690 --> 00:33:24,269 tea and hot water to extract these. 854 00:33:25,290 --> 00:33:27,599 They're called bado 855 00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:29,999 glands, something like that. 856 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,459 But these are the molecules that 857 00:33:32,460 --> 00:33:34,739 that get extracted into the water and 858 00:33:34,740 --> 00:33:36,419 they're actually preventing the 859 00:33:36,420 --> 00:33:37,770 anticancer properties. 860 00:33:39,150 --> 00:33:41,339 So one of the mushrooms is 861 00:33:41,340 --> 00:33:43,409 called Gaitskell Phylum Comune, I don't 862 00:33:43,410 --> 00:33:45,629 know if you can remember that, but 863 00:33:45,630 --> 00:33:48,329 it's one of the most common mushrooms 864 00:33:48,330 --> 00:33:50,399 in the world. That's why it's called 865 00:33:50,400 --> 00:33:52,289 schizo phylum Comune. 866 00:33:52,290 --> 00:33:54,839 And another mushroom that we investigated 867 00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:55,979 was the oyster mushroom. 868 00:33:57,180 --> 00:33:58,390 Yeah. Mm hmm. 869 00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:01,910 Oh, one, please. 870 00:34:03,410 --> 00:34:04,639 Thank you for your talk. 871 00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:06,799 I have two questions 872 00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:07,800 once 873 00:34:09,290 --> 00:34:11,448 I evaluate that, I know 874 00:34:11,449 --> 00:34:13,698 in the discourse of 875 00:34:13,699 --> 00:34:16,249 personal disrupter endocrine disruptors 876 00:34:16,250 --> 00:34:18,349 and like plastics 877 00:34:18,350 --> 00:34:21,079 and ecological type topics 878 00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:23,238 overall, I've evaluated 879 00:34:23,239 --> 00:34:25,549 highly. When someone gives out, 880 00:34:25,550 --> 00:34:27,678 it's not only discussed, but also 881 00:34:27,679 --> 00:34:29,718 options are given, like you have done in 882 00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:31,939 your project, educating people about 883 00:34:31,940 --> 00:34:34,879 it and empowering them to test 884 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:36,289 their environment for that. 885 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:39,619 But I have to say to me that 886 00:34:41,719 --> 00:34:43,729 it would be challenging to to ensure 887 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:47,599 that your term of toxic embrace it is new 888 00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:49,209 to me. And I have to say I'm 889 00:34:50,210 --> 00:34:52,399 not sure yet how I would stand to that. 890 00:34:54,260 --> 00:34:56,479 And I would ask, why 891 00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:57,559 do you prefer? 892 00:34:59,030 --> 00:35:00,350 Why do you choose to 893 00:35:02,630 --> 00:35:05,089 educate people about it rather 894 00:35:05,090 --> 00:35:07,729 than trying so that they can 895 00:35:07,730 --> 00:35:10,759 care for themselves rather than 896 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,219 trying to disrupt this industrial 897 00:35:13,220 --> 00:35:14,220 practice? 898 00:35:15,510 --> 00:35:16,499 Mm hmm. 899 00:35:16,500 --> 00:35:19,079 Well, I think that there I'm encouraging 900 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:21,209 both both things, both 901 00:35:21,210 --> 00:35:23,549 practices, I mean, disrupting 902 00:35:23,550 --> 00:35:24,509 the industrial. 903 00:35:24,510 --> 00:35:27,059 OK, well, um, 904 00:35:27,060 --> 00:35:29,279 I'm not going to to lie 905 00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:31,619 and say it's easy to disrupt companies 906 00:35:31,620 --> 00:35:33,809 like Monsanto. It's really difficult. 907 00:35:33,810 --> 00:35:36,119 And so my practices is 908 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:37,859 hyper local, which means that, you know, 909 00:35:37,860 --> 00:35:40,199 I, I try to affect change 910 00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:41,849 in the in the people who join my 911 00:35:41,850 --> 00:35:42,959 workshops. 912 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,119 And it's 913 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,429 and I think that having awareness 914 00:35:47,430 --> 00:35:49,529 or having a consciousness 915 00:35:49,530 --> 00:35:51,989 about all the pollutants in 916 00:35:51,990 --> 00:35:54,059 the water supply and I mean, even 917 00:35:54,060 --> 00:35:56,309 if that ends up just affecting 918 00:35:56,310 --> 00:35:58,019 your consumer choices. 919 00:35:58,020 --> 00:35:59,969 But, you know, this can this can really 920 00:35:59,970 --> 00:36:02,399 help to, um, 921 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:05,139 be to increase the amount of autonomy 922 00:36:05,140 --> 00:36:07,259 you have in your own body and in your own 923 00:36:07,260 --> 00:36:08,399 environment. 924 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:10,529 So, um, and thank 925 00:36:10,530 --> 00:36:12,449 you for bringing up this this kind of 926 00:36:12,450 --> 00:36:14,909 tension about the phrase toxic embrace, 927 00:36:14,910 --> 00:36:17,039 because I also have a lot of, 928 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:19,289 um, I'm still trying to 929 00:36:19,290 --> 00:36:22,080 to reconcile what that means because. 930 00:36:24,230 --> 00:36:26,179 I think for a lot of people, it's it's 931 00:36:26,180 --> 00:36:28,579 very, very paralyzing to realize 932 00:36:28,580 --> 00:36:30,799 that how how 933 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:32,749 polluted our environment is and how we 934 00:36:32,750 --> 00:36:34,129 can't escape this. 935 00:36:34,130 --> 00:36:35,999 And so where do we go from here? 936 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,299 Like how do we move beyond now knowing 937 00:36:38,300 --> 00:36:40,759 these scandalous levels of estrogen 938 00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:41,809 in the water supply? 939 00:36:41,810 --> 00:36:44,189 I mean, you know, and and 940 00:36:44,190 --> 00:36:46,249 and I'm exploring different 941 00:36:46,250 --> 00:36:47,599 kinds of discourses. 942 00:36:47,600 --> 00:36:49,699 And one of them is like, well, 943 00:36:49,700 --> 00:36:51,829 why don't we look at these molecules like 944 00:36:51,830 --> 00:36:53,809 our progeny, like our children and be 945 00:36:53,810 --> 00:36:55,579 responsible for them, like they are our 946 00:36:55,580 --> 00:36:56,599 children. 947 00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:57,600 And 948 00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:01,519 and I guess when I say toxic, embrace 949 00:37:01,520 --> 00:37:03,559 them actually I mean, like embrace the 950 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,629 queer, like embrace the other, 951 00:37:05,630 --> 00:37:07,699 embrace bodies of difference because they 952 00:37:07,700 --> 00:37:09,109 exist already and they're going to 953 00:37:09,110 --> 00:37:11,179 continue to increase because 954 00:37:11,180 --> 00:37:13,609 we see all these effects 955 00:37:13,610 --> 00:37:15,289 of these enduring disruptors. 956 00:37:15,290 --> 00:37:18,019 We're going to see a lot of weird 957 00:37:18,020 --> 00:37:20,419 mutated beings, a lot of queer 958 00:37:20,420 --> 00:37:21,679 beings. 959 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:22,790 So, yeah. 960 00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:29,449 I had to I 961 00:37:29,450 --> 00:37:31,429 was reminded of Paul Preciado, 962 00:37:32,600 --> 00:37:34,339 and I'm interested, would you also do 963 00:37:34,340 --> 00:37:36,049 this kind of project for testosterone and 964 00:37:36,050 --> 00:37:37,759 do you think that awesome. 965 00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:38,760 Yeah. 966 00:37:40,510 --> 00:37:42,219 I've thought about it, I don't know, I'm 967 00:37:42,220 --> 00:37:44,139 still a little bit estrogen obsessed 968 00:37:44,140 --> 00:37:46,630 right now, but, um. 969 00:37:48,030 --> 00:37:50,669 Yeah, because there's definitely 970 00:37:50,670 --> 00:37:52,829 there aren't as many uses for 971 00:37:52,830 --> 00:37:54,869 testosterone as they are for estrogen. 972 00:37:54,870 --> 00:37:56,999 I mean, if we if we compare estrogen 973 00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,159 and testosterone and what 974 00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:01,349 kind of bio capital is made, 975 00:38:01,350 --> 00:38:02,729 you know, estrogen is definitely in the 976 00:38:02,730 --> 00:38:04,669 lead. I mean, estrogen and progestin 977 00:38:04,670 --> 00:38:05,670 thrown. 978 00:38:06,540 --> 00:38:08,999 They are the most highly manufactured 979 00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:10,679 synthetic compounds in the world, 980 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:12,359 actually. That's how much money and 981 00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,249 profit these companies are making. 982 00:38:14,250 --> 00:38:16,829 But, yeah, testosterone is definitely 983 00:38:16,830 --> 00:38:18,309 an interest. 984 00:38:18,310 --> 00:38:19,310 Yeah. 985 00:38:20,340 --> 00:38:21,329 Thank you. 986 00:38:21,330 --> 00:38:22,330 Mm hmm. 987 00:38:22,890 --> 00:38:24,929 Microphone four, please. 988 00:38:27,010 --> 00:38:28,149 Hello. 989 00:38:28,150 --> 00:38:30,759 Are you also looking to 990 00:38:30,760 --> 00:38:33,099 estrogen escalator's 991 00:38:33,100 --> 00:38:35,169 the ways how to remove estrogen 992 00:38:35,170 --> 00:38:36,579 from the environment? 993 00:38:37,790 --> 00:38:39,830 He later, yes, OK, 994 00:38:41,540 --> 00:38:43,579 well, yeah, that's what the fungus 995 00:38:43,580 --> 00:38:46,819 project is kind of exploring, because 996 00:38:46,820 --> 00:38:48,289 what's interesting is, you know, they 997 00:38:48,290 --> 00:38:50,369 have they 998 00:38:50,370 --> 00:38:52,369 they're naturally occurring enzymes that 999 00:38:52,370 --> 00:38:54,469 the mushrooms are producing because they 1000 00:38:54,470 --> 00:38:57,199 produce the same enzymes to 1001 00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,269 basically eat 1002 00:38:59,270 --> 00:39:01,519 trees that are rotting and dying. 1003 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:04,369 So these same enzymes 1004 00:39:04,370 --> 00:39:07,099 are breaking down these plastic molecules 1005 00:39:07,100 --> 00:39:09,679 because they have these similar 1006 00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:11,779 basically like these multi 1007 00:39:11,780 --> 00:39:13,129 carbon chains. 1008 00:39:13,130 --> 00:39:15,229 So this fungus can actually do 1009 00:39:15,230 --> 00:39:16,489 the same job. 1010 00:39:16,490 --> 00:39:18,739 And so that's the 1011 00:39:18,740 --> 00:39:21,019 An aside from Yanan, the extraction, 1012 00:39:21,020 --> 00:39:22,639 I mean, it's it's very difficult to 1013 00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:25,129 extract and purify all the 1014 00:39:25,130 --> 00:39:27,529 other water that exists. 1015 00:39:27,530 --> 00:39:29,629 It's more of a way to combine that 1016 00:39:29,630 --> 00:39:30,949 with the yeast biosensors. 1017 00:39:30,950 --> 00:39:33,139 I would say the fungus trajectory 1018 00:39:33,140 --> 00:39:34,789 is the closest to this kind of 1019 00:39:34,790 --> 00:39:35,989 bioremediation. 1020 00:39:39,620 --> 00:39:41,719 And if anyone is working with, like 1021 00:39:41,720 --> 00:39:44,239 detecting extracting bioremediation 1022 00:39:44,240 --> 00:39:46,309 of Anacreon, disrupting molecules, like, 1023 00:39:46,310 --> 00:39:47,989 please come talk to me. 1024 00:39:50,700 --> 00:39:51,900 Microphone three, please. 1025 00:39:52,950 --> 00:39:55,139 Hello. Um, do you perceive 1026 00:39:55,140 --> 00:39:57,269 any potential danger with this type of 1027 00:39:57,270 --> 00:39:59,339 biohacking, for example, a 1028 00:39:59,340 --> 00:40:01,439 person doing yourself experiment gone 1029 00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:02,369 wrong? 1030 00:40:02,370 --> 00:40:04,499 Or perhaps they try something like 1031 00:40:04,500 --> 00:40:06,689 this instead of traditional medicine and 1032 00:40:06,690 --> 00:40:08,759 end up hurting themselves somehow 1033 00:40:08,760 --> 00:40:10,409 and then especially in the position of a 1034 00:40:10,410 --> 00:40:11,039 teacher. 1035 00:40:11,040 --> 00:40:12,779 How do you mitigate this risk if you 1036 00:40:12,780 --> 00:40:14,239 perceive it. 1037 00:40:14,240 --> 00:40:15,269 Mhm. 1038 00:40:15,270 --> 00:40:17,699 That's definitely a 1039 00:40:17,700 --> 00:40:19,529 an issue that we thought about a lot 1040 00:40:19,530 --> 00:40:22,199 because when we were 1041 00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:24,329 researching all these protocols, 1042 00:40:24,330 --> 00:40:26,549 you know actually the first 1043 00:40:26,550 --> 00:40:28,709 protocol that I wanted that I wanted 1044 00:40:28,710 --> 00:40:31,049 to do was to modify 1045 00:40:31,050 --> 00:40:33,209 yeast, to basically produce estrogen, 1046 00:40:33,210 --> 00:40:34,919 to be these like estrogen synthesis 1047 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:36,029 factories. 1048 00:40:36,030 --> 00:40:38,249 And I 1049 00:40:38,250 --> 00:40:40,889 was consulting with scientists 1050 00:40:40,890 --> 00:40:42,959 for three months or so and they're 1051 00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,119 all telling me, like, Mary, this project 1052 00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:46,199 is impossible. 1053 00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:48,419 You need like a team of scientists. 1054 00:40:48,420 --> 00:40:50,429 And because basically, if you look at the 1055 00:40:50,430 --> 00:40:53,099 metabolic pathway of producing 1056 00:40:53,100 --> 00:40:55,349 estrogen from cholesterol, you 1057 00:40:55,350 --> 00:40:57,839 have to knock in five or six genes 1058 00:40:57,840 --> 00:40:59,969 into the yeast to get it to 1059 00:40:59,970 --> 00:41:02,129 produce estrogen, which is really, 1060 00:41:02,130 --> 00:41:04,889 really difficult, genetic engineering. 1061 00:41:04,890 --> 00:41:05,890 And so. 1062 00:41:07,030 --> 00:41:08,779 Sorry, I forgot what the question was. 1063 00:41:08,780 --> 00:41:10,219 Oh, yeah, sorry. 1064 00:41:10,220 --> 00:41:11,629 And so but then, you know, but we 1065 00:41:11,630 --> 00:41:13,429 definitely thought about well if we did 1066 00:41:13,430 --> 00:41:15,649 create this protocol 1067 00:41:15,650 --> 00:41:17,869 and if we did like if we 1068 00:41:17,870 --> 00:41:20,509 did distribute these used, 1069 00:41:20,510 --> 00:41:22,039 you know, what kind of dangers would 1070 00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:23,089 arise. 1071 00:41:23,090 --> 00:41:25,189 And I have 1072 00:41:25,190 --> 00:41:27,379 to say, I mean, I'm not a super expert 1073 00:41:27,380 --> 00:41:29,869 in in trans hormone therapy 1074 00:41:29,870 --> 00:41:30,829 or anything like that. 1075 00:41:30,830 --> 00:41:32,899 But from what I know, 1076 00:41:32,900 --> 00:41:35,329 its hormones are so 1077 00:41:35,330 --> 00:41:38,209 potent and so sensitive 1078 00:41:38,210 --> 00:41:40,129 to every individual. 1079 00:41:40,130 --> 00:41:42,229 And so you really need to have a lot 1080 00:41:42,230 --> 00:41:44,089 of knowledge about your own blood work 1081 00:41:44,090 --> 00:41:46,489 and, you know, like about your own body 1082 00:41:46,490 --> 00:41:48,739 chemistry to know like what 1083 00:41:48,740 --> 00:41:50,869 kind of dosage to give yourself. 1084 00:41:50,870 --> 00:41:52,969 That's what that's what trans people like 1085 00:41:52,970 --> 00:41:53,869 when they go to a doctor. 1086 00:41:53,870 --> 00:41:55,669 They have to do all these tests to figure 1087 00:41:55,670 --> 00:41:57,079 out the right dosage. 1088 00:41:57,080 --> 00:41:59,329 And even the doctors still get it wrong, 1089 00:41:59,330 --> 00:42:00,769 you know, because a lot of doctors are 1090 00:42:00,770 --> 00:42:02,839 not actually knowledgeable in 1091 00:42:02,840 --> 00:42:03,949 transition therapy. 1092 00:42:03,950 --> 00:42:05,620 So, um, 1093 00:42:07,190 --> 00:42:08,449 yeah, it's a huge risk. 1094 00:42:08,450 --> 00:42:11,059 It's it's an it's an ethical risk. 1095 00:42:11,060 --> 00:42:13,279 And I definitely know people 1096 00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:15,799 who would take that risk 1097 00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:17,780 to live in the body that they want. 1098 00:42:21,930 --> 00:42:24,869 So the Internet has a question. 1099 00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:27,389 Yes, that's a terminology question 1100 00:42:27,390 --> 00:42:29,549 and the Internet is asking, why 1101 00:42:29,550 --> 00:42:31,859 is referring to fish with sexual 1102 00:42:31,860 --> 00:42:35,009 orientation as transgender wrong? 1103 00:42:35,010 --> 00:42:37,469 How does that compare to the. 1104 00:42:37,470 --> 00:42:39,719 I got tons of definitions we use 1105 00:42:39,720 --> 00:42:40,949 for human species. 1106 00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:44,849 Well, I think it's because it's it's 1107 00:42:44,850 --> 00:42:47,219 creating this connotation that 1108 00:42:47,220 --> 00:42:49,439 trans bodies are somehow 1109 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:51,809 chemically mutated, which is, 1110 00:42:51,810 --> 00:42:53,909 I think, kind of a derogatory 1111 00:42:53,910 --> 00:42:55,619 way to to look at it. 1112 00:42:55,620 --> 00:42:57,929 I mean, I think that maybe 1113 00:42:57,930 --> 00:43:00,119 the term intersex or 1114 00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:02,249 multi sex would be a 1115 00:43:02,250 --> 00:43:04,409 better term. But, you know, I 1116 00:43:04,410 --> 00:43:06,479 had this this feeling that scientists 1117 00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:09,179 just didn't have the the terminology 1118 00:43:09,180 --> 00:43:11,279 to to know what to call these 1119 00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:13,619 frogs and fish when they saw, like, 1120 00:43:13,620 --> 00:43:15,299 you know, they would open up these frogs 1121 00:43:15,300 --> 00:43:17,909 and find like five ovaries 1122 00:43:17,910 --> 00:43:19,709 next to six testicles. 1123 00:43:19,710 --> 00:43:21,569 And they just had no idea what was going 1124 00:43:21,570 --> 00:43:23,819 on. They're like, oh, they're trans. 1125 00:43:23,820 --> 00:43:26,039 And, you know, we have to like we 1126 00:43:26,040 --> 00:43:27,479 have to be aware. 1127 00:43:27,480 --> 00:43:29,340 The terminology that we're using 1128 00:43:30,870 --> 00:43:32,939 is, you know, there's a 1129 00:43:32,940 --> 00:43:35,009 really thin line between, like, 1130 00:43:35,010 --> 00:43:37,229 how we perceive 1131 00:43:37,230 --> 00:43:39,359 non-human species to how we 1132 00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:40,409 perceive our own 1133 00:43:41,970 --> 00:43:44,189 people that live among us, 1134 00:43:44,190 --> 00:43:46,319 you know? So, um, I don't 1135 00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:48,149 know that answers the question. 1136 00:43:48,150 --> 00:43:50,309 Um, and we just got a certain 1137 00:43:50,310 --> 00:43:52,409 question. And the second question 1138 00:43:52,410 --> 00:43:54,599 is, have you done any work to 1139 00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:57,029 map the estrogen's people have measured 1140 00:43:57,030 --> 00:43:58,679 with a home measurement technique. 1141 00:44:00,590 --> 00:44:03,259 What's the home measuring technique? 1142 00:44:03,260 --> 00:44:05,260 I don't know. Yeah, I just asked, 1143 00:44:06,380 --> 00:44:07,639 but that's kind of interesting. 1144 00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:09,849 I'd like to research more into that. 1145 00:44:13,710 --> 00:44:14,710 Make one, please. 1146 00:44:16,480 --> 00:44:17,480 Oh, by the way, 1147 00:44:19,090 --> 00:44:21,010 um, so 1148 00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:24,309 one of the major obstacles that the trans 1149 00:44:24,310 --> 00:44:26,919 community faces is medical gatekeeping. 1150 00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:29,019 So doctors often 1151 00:44:29,020 --> 00:44:31,149 misunderstanding the possible side 1152 00:44:31,150 --> 00:44:33,639 effects and 1153 00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:35,200 failing to prescribe. 1154 00:44:38,020 --> 00:44:40,209 And that often 1155 00:44:40,210 --> 00:44:42,519 is due to misconceptions that. 1156 00:44:44,310 --> 00:44:46,409 So about the effects 1157 00:44:46,410 --> 00:44:48,599 of different types of estrogen, 1158 00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:49,600 for example, 1159 00:44:50,970 --> 00:44:52,739 that are not supported by medical 1160 00:44:52,740 --> 00:44:54,839 evidence. So I'll give you a specific 1161 00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:56,069 example. 1162 00:44:56,070 --> 00:44:58,530 Many doctors think that prescribing 1163 00:44:59,610 --> 00:45:01,919 estrogen will increase the risk of breast 1164 00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:04,079 cancer for people who have 1165 00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:05,519 a family history of breast cancer. 1166 00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:07,919 There is actually no evidence of that 1167 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:10,019 for biological estrogens 1168 00:45:10,020 --> 00:45:11,020 without progesterone. 1169 00:45:12,480 --> 00:45:15,689 So they have these misconceptions. 1170 00:45:17,490 --> 00:45:19,759 Do you think that 1171 00:45:19,760 --> 00:45:22,049 sort of a lucky shot 1172 00:45:22,050 --> 00:45:24,129 was was to 1173 00:45:24,130 --> 00:45:25,130 have. 1174 00:45:25,980 --> 00:45:29,039 Flying often outweigh the risks 1175 00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:30,659 when, in fact, the problem that trans 1176 00:45:30,660 --> 00:45:32,879 people have is that 1177 00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,849 the perception of risk is too high. 1178 00:45:35,850 --> 00:45:36,959 I see. 1179 00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:38,819 Well, what you're describing are these 1180 00:45:38,820 --> 00:45:40,889 bioidentical and I've 1181 00:45:40,890 --> 00:45:42,779 actually come across a lot of research 1182 00:45:42,780 --> 00:45:45,119 saying like that they're 1183 00:45:45,120 --> 00:45:47,549 much safer than the synthetic 1184 00:45:47,550 --> 00:45:49,409 estrogens and progesterones that are 1185 00:45:49,410 --> 00:45:50,939 being prescribed. 1186 00:45:50,940 --> 00:45:53,189 Those are the ones that, yeah, 1187 00:45:53,190 --> 00:45:55,829 we're causing a lot of health effects. 1188 00:45:55,830 --> 00:45:58,079 And what people say like, oh, but, 1189 00:45:58,080 --> 00:46:00,239 you know, our grandmother's 1190 00:46:00,240 --> 00:46:01,709 generation, when they were taking the 1191 00:46:01,710 --> 00:46:03,359 pills, it was like three times the 1192 00:46:03,360 --> 00:46:05,669 dosage. And that's why all these effects 1193 00:46:05,670 --> 00:46:07,559 were happening. And now it's like much 1194 00:46:07,560 --> 00:46:09,479 lower in concentration. 1195 00:46:09,480 --> 00:46:11,639 But I mean, again, it depends 1196 00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:13,109 on your body. 1197 00:46:13,110 --> 00:46:14,309 Like, we don't know. 1198 00:46:14,310 --> 00:46:16,109 Um, I guess the point I'm trying to make 1199 00:46:16,110 --> 00:46:18,209 is that we don't know whose bodies 1200 00:46:18,210 --> 00:46:19,679 were in the clinical trials when they 1201 00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:21,929 were, you know, testing each compound 1202 00:46:21,930 --> 00:46:23,369 or each drug or whatever. 1203 00:46:23,370 --> 00:46:25,469 Like I remember when I was in 1204 00:46:25,470 --> 00:46:27,689 high school, my mom told 1205 00:46:27,690 --> 00:46:29,459 me to go on birth control pills. 1206 00:46:29,460 --> 00:46:31,529 And then I and then one day 1207 00:46:31,530 --> 00:46:33,059 she went to the doctor because she was 1208 00:46:33,060 --> 00:46:35,249 getting hot flashes and the doctor gave 1209 00:46:35,250 --> 00:46:37,139 her the same exact pills that I was 1210 00:46:37,140 --> 00:46:39,239 taking for birth control. 1211 00:46:39,240 --> 00:46:41,519 And so it made me think, 1212 00:46:41,520 --> 00:46:42,929 like these doctors, like, do they know 1213 00:46:42,930 --> 00:46:45,149 what they're prescribing to people? 1214 00:46:45,150 --> 00:46:46,589 Maybe they know. 1215 00:46:46,590 --> 00:46:47,939 Yeah, it's OK. 1216 00:46:47,940 --> 00:46:49,979 And, you know, that makes you think, 1217 00:46:49,980 --> 00:46:52,259 well, we shouldn't rely 1218 00:46:52,260 --> 00:46:54,869 too heavily on on medical practitioners. 1219 00:46:54,870 --> 00:46:56,969 I mean, we we should be able to have 1220 00:46:56,970 --> 00:46:59,129 our own autonomy to know our 1221 00:46:59,130 --> 00:47:00,779 bodies and to know what's right for our 1222 00:47:00,780 --> 00:47:01,919 bodies. 1223 00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:03,599 I mean, but it's. 1224 00:47:03,600 --> 00:47:05,369 Yeah, it's everyone's own 1225 00:47:06,840 --> 00:47:07,889 preference. 1226 00:47:07,890 --> 00:47:09,899 That's true. On the other hand, some of 1227 00:47:09,900 --> 00:47:11,309 this information is just really 1228 00:47:11,310 --> 00:47:13,809 straightforward. And every night, 1229 00:47:13,810 --> 00:47:14,810 every. 1230 00:47:20,220 --> 00:47:21,399 Microphone three, please. 1231 00:47:23,250 --> 00:47:25,219 I thank you for your excellent work. 1232 00:47:25,220 --> 00:47:26,209 It's really amazing. 1233 00:47:26,210 --> 00:47:28,219 I was wondering, when you talk about the 1234 00:47:28,220 --> 00:47:30,589 collaboration in which areas 1235 00:47:30,590 --> 00:47:32,779 of the world you are collaborating with, 1236 00:47:32,780 --> 00:47:35,059 people and friends, you said and maybe 1237 00:47:35,060 --> 00:47:37,399 also if you could tell a bit 1238 00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:39,469 about your experience and the 1239 00:47:39,470 --> 00:47:41,389 cultural differences maybe and the 1240 00:47:41,390 --> 00:47:43,519 willingness to adopt your 1241 00:47:43,520 --> 00:47:45,769 methods or to collaborate with you 1242 00:47:45,770 --> 00:47:48,139 and change the mindset and how we 1243 00:47:48,140 --> 00:47:50,269 think about the topic and all the issues 1244 00:47:50,270 --> 00:47:51,809 related to that. 1245 00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:55,069 Most of my collaborators are coming from 1246 00:47:55,070 --> 00:47:57,439 the U.S. and Europe, so basically 1247 00:47:57,440 --> 00:47:59,809 very Western perspectives working 1248 00:47:59,810 --> 00:48:01,069 on this project. 1249 00:48:01,070 --> 00:48:03,559 I've done workshops in Hong Kong 1250 00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:05,659 and Indonesia 1251 00:48:05,660 --> 00:48:07,550 and, um. 1252 00:48:08,730 --> 00:48:11,669 I mean, I definitely had to 1253 00:48:11,670 --> 00:48:13,919 tweak the narrative a bit, 1254 00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:16,169 I mean, I did the one 1255 00:48:16,170 --> 00:48:18,359 workshop I did in Hong Kong, 1256 00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:20,429 I I was collaborating 1257 00:48:20,430 --> 00:48:22,829 with an artist, a jazz fan, 1258 00:48:22,830 --> 00:48:24,989 and we actually tried to frame it 1259 00:48:24,990 --> 00:48:27,779 as like a satire on 1260 00:48:27,780 --> 00:48:30,029 beauty culture in Hong Kong, 1261 00:48:30,030 --> 00:48:32,129 because it's 1262 00:48:32,130 --> 00:48:34,769 I mean, they're really big on cosmetics 1263 00:48:34,770 --> 00:48:36,569 and facial creams and things like that. 1264 00:48:36,570 --> 00:48:39,569 And so we decided, like, let's 1265 00:48:39,570 --> 00:48:42,689 extract the hormones from 1266 00:48:42,690 --> 00:48:44,789 our mutual friend who used to be a 1267 00:48:44,790 --> 00:48:45,699 beauty pageant. 1268 00:48:45,700 --> 00:48:47,579 Let's take her urine, let's take her 1269 00:48:47,580 --> 00:48:49,949 hormones, her estrogen's and then let's 1270 00:48:49,950 --> 00:48:52,499 mix it into face cream 1271 00:48:52,500 --> 00:48:55,649 and we'll call it like 1272 00:48:55,650 --> 00:48:57,899 like a beauty spa treatment 1273 00:48:57,900 --> 00:48:59,969 to beautify yourself, to 1274 00:48:59,970 --> 00:49:01,529 become more feminine. 1275 00:49:01,530 --> 00:49:04,409 So we did it as a kind of satire. 1276 00:49:04,410 --> 00:49:07,469 But I would say that, you know, and 1277 00:49:07,470 --> 00:49:09,899 in the East 1278 00:49:09,900 --> 00:49:12,239 Asian, South East Asian 1279 00:49:12,240 --> 00:49:14,069 parts of the world, maybe they're 1280 00:49:14,070 --> 00:49:16,289 feminisms are a little bit behind 1281 00:49:16,290 --> 00:49:18,839 compared to like Western feminisms. 1282 00:49:18,840 --> 00:49:21,869 But I'm just overgeneralizing 1283 00:49:21,870 --> 00:49:24,419 I know in some parts that's not true, 1284 00:49:24,420 --> 00:49:26,609 but, um, I would 1285 00:49:26,610 --> 00:49:28,979 like to actually get out of this 1286 00:49:28,980 --> 00:49:31,199 like Eurocentric or Western centric 1287 00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:33,329 perspective on hormones. 1288 00:49:33,330 --> 00:49:35,639 And yeah, if anyone wants 1289 00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:37,380 to collaborate, let me know. 1290 00:49:40,700 --> 00:49:42,030 Microphone four, please. 1291 00:49:43,770 --> 00:49:45,360 Hello, I'm. 1292 00:49:46,830 --> 00:49:49,019 The question to us and we go talked about 1293 00:49:49,020 --> 00:49:51,839 gatekeeping for trans individuals 1294 00:49:51,840 --> 00:49:52,840 as a matter of 1295 00:49:54,060 --> 00:49:56,159 misconception, but 1296 00:49:56,160 --> 00:49:58,319 there's obviously another element which 1297 00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:00,389 has to do with latent bigotry and the 1298 00:50:00,390 --> 00:50:02,399 powers that be having vested interests in 1299 00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,079 colonizing our genders. 1300 00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:07,109 And certainly some of 1301 00:50:07,110 --> 00:50:09,119 your you're talking addressed a lot of 1302 00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:10,599 those points and trying to. 1303 00:50:11,850 --> 00:50:13,769 Erode those structures through your 1304 00:50:13,770 --> 00:50:15,300 performances, but 1305 00:50:17,640 --> 00:50:18,839 the question, I guess the question is 1306 00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:19,840 more about. 1307 00:50:21,220 --> 00:50:24,039 Your work about granting 1308 00:50:24,040 --> 00:50:26,110 individuals more formal agency, 1309 00:50:27,560 --> 00:50:29,409 do you think how do you think this would 1310 00:50:29,410 --> 00:50:31,629 this will interact 1311 00:50:31,630 --> 00:50:32,630 with? 1312 00:50:34,060 --> 00:50:35,060 With. 1313 00:50:35,630 --> 00:50:38,419 Institutional goals, 1314 00:50:38,420 --> 00:50:40,789 institutional gatekeeping for 1315 00:50:40,790 --> 00:50:42,469 towards trans bodies, do you think that? 1316 00:50:44,510 --> 00:50:46,539 Additional agency from the individual 1317 00:50:46,540 --> 00:50:49,139 noninstitutional level would would 1318 00:50:49,140 --> 00:50:51,289 it wouldn't contribute to eroding this 1319 00:50:51,290 --> 00:50:52,699 hegemony, or do you think it would 1320 00:50:52,700 --> 00:50:55,159 trigger a reaction that would 1321 00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:57,559 add an additional gatekeeping and 1322 00:50:57,560 --> 00:50:58,560 restrictions? 1323 00:50:59,640 --> 00:51:02,009 I think it's really hard to make a dent 1324 00:51:02,010 --> 00:51:05,129 in these pharmaceutical 1325 00:51:05,130 --> 00:51:06,179 industries. 1326 00:51:06,180 --> 00:51:08,369 I mean, the 1327 00:51:08,370 --> 00:51:10,079 artists who I mentioned collaborating 1328 00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:12,479 with Ryan Hammond, 1329 00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:15,209 they're actually going forward with this 1330 00:51:15,210 --> 00:51:17,579 yeast synthesis protocol, like 1331 00:51:17,580 --> 00:51:18,899 they've actually and they're they're 1332 00:51:18,900 --> 00:51:21,449 working on an artists like Shoestring 1333 00:51:21,450 --> 00:51:23,519 Budget. And I really commend them 1334 00:51:23,520 --> 00:51:25,140 for that. And. 1335 00:51:27,120 --> 00:51:28,120 I think. 1336 00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:31,339 As Ryan is creating 1337 00:51:31,340 --> 00:51:33,949 that organism, that transgenic used 1338 00:51:33,950 --> 00:51:36,229 to produce hormones, 1339 00:51:36,230 --> 00:51:38,299 they're also really consciously 1340 00:51:38,300 --> 00:51:40,669 aware of how those companies 1341 00:51:40,670 --> 00:51:43,669 could come in and basically ruin 1342 00:51:43,670 --> 00:51:45,889 what what they're doing, 1343 00:51:45,890 --> 00:51:47,839 you know, because we're talking about 1344 00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:49,849 like, yeah, it's a David and Goliath 1345 00:51:49,850 --> 00:51:51,019 situation. 1346 00:51:51,020 --> 00:51:52,849 I think the companies have much more 1347 00:51:52,850 --> 00:51:55,489 power to come in and say, 1348 00:51:55,490 --> 00:51:56,789 you can't be doing that research. 1349 00:51:56,790 --> 00:51:58,189 We have a patent on that. 1350 00:51:58,190 --> 00:51:59,190 So. 1351 00:52:00,550 --> 00:52:02,259 So it's interesting, right, like as an 1352 00:52:02,260 --> 00:52:04,869 artist in the bio hacker, you're also 1353 00:52:04,870 --> 00:52:06,549 like you're also talking with, like 1354 00:52:06,550 --> 00:52:08,889 lawyers and and trying 1355 00:52:08,890 --> 00:52:11,289 to get, like, free consultation on that. 1356 00:52:11,290 --> 00:52:12,290 Um. 1357 00:52:13,500 --> 00:52:16,019 You know, a lot of artists have done like 1358 00:52:16,020 --> 00:52:17,969 protest art or whatever against like 1359 00:52:17,970 --> 00:52:20,549 Monsanto and these big and these big like 1360 00:52:20,550 --> 00:52:22,979 giants, these Goliath's 1361 00:52:22,980 --> 00:52:23,980 and. 1362 00:52:25,310 --> 00:52:27,559 I think it's actually bad PR 1363 00:52:27,560 --> 00:52:29,869 for them if they go after artists, 1364 00:52:29,870 --> 00:52:32,089 but, um, I think 1365 00:52:32,090 --> 00:52:34,519 it's really hard to like, actually. 1366 00:52:35,600 --> 00:52:38,059 To to make a dent in these 1367 00:52:38,060 --> 00:52:40,459 companies, it has to happen at the policy 1368 00:52:40,460 --> 00:52:41,479 level. 1369 00:52:41,480 --> 00:52:43,309 I think like what we're doing as artists, 1370 00:52:43,310 --> 00:52:45,500 bio hackers, performance artists is not. 1371 00:52:47,950 --> 00:52:49,569 Well, who knows, right? 1372 00:52:49,570 --> 00:52:51,759 Who knows, maybe I'm underestimating 1373 00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:52,760 what we can do. 1374 00:52:55,690 --> 00:52:57,639 So I believe you do, I think you freak 1375 00:52:57,640 --> 00:52:58,640 him out a lot. 1376 00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:01,569 Microphone one, please. 1377 00:53:01,570 --> 00:53:02,570 Uh, yeah. 1378 00:53:03,610 --> 00:53:05,829 So I was wondering if you have thought 1379 00:53:05,830 --> 00:53:08,139 about, um, uh, 1380 00:53:08,140 --> 00:53:10,599 more like mechanical aspects 1381 00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:12,999 of, uh, morphological freedom 1382 00:53:13,000 --> 00:53:14,679 or a body modification or gender 1383 00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:16,959 transition, uh, like surgery 1384 00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:19,239 or prosthetics and, uh, like 1385 00:53:19,240 --> 00:53:21,009 anything from a roadmap to totally 1386 00:53:21,010 --> 00:53:22,309 speculative fiction. 1387 00:53:22,310 --> 00:53:24,340 Well, that out I put it in that. 1388 00:53:25,680 --> 00:53:28,289 Mechanical, uh, 1389 00:53:28,290 --> 00:53:31,589 like augmentation, you mean, or 1390 00:53:31,590 --> 00:53:33,239 augmentation, but like anything from 1391 00:53:33,240 --> 00:53:34,380 surgery to 1392 00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:36,929 when you're talking about a gender 1393 00:53:36,930 --> 00:53:38,699 transition technology, of course, like 1394 00:53:38,700 --> 00:53:41,099 surgery, um, 1395 00:53:41,100 --> 00:53:43,469 to to make your body as you want 1396 00:53:43,470 --> 00:53:46,289 it to be, because you 1397 00:53:46,290 --> 00:53:48,479 tend to focus on hormones, which 1398 00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:49,619 is awesome. 1399 00:53:49,620 --> 00:53:51,419 But I was also thinking about whether you 1400 00:53:51,420 --> 00:53:53,579 have also considered whether you 1401 00:53:53,580 --> 00:53:56,009 could maybe do surgery at home 1402 00:53:56,010 --> 00:53:58,319 and at some point in the future 1403 00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:00,150 or self organized or whatever. 1404 00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:03,529 I that's that sounds 1405 00:54:03,530 --> 00:54:04,789 really scary, I don't know. 1406 00:54:04,790 --> 00:54:06,649 I've never considered that. 1407 00:54:06,650 --> 00:54:08,359 No, you're talking I mean, 1408 00:54:09,700 --> 00:54:11,779 I I'm familiar with a couple 1409 00:54:11,780 --> 00:54:12,979 of. Yeah. 1410 00:54:12,980 --> 00:54:15,889 Like DIY abortion kits or like, 1411 00:54:15,890 --> 00:54:18,109 um, I've never heard of any like 1412 00:54:18,110 --> 00:54:20,269 DIY like top surgery, though, 1413 00:54:20,270 --> 00:54:22,159 but that sounds really, really neat. 1414 00:54:22,160 --> 00:54:24,199 But maybe it might happen someday. 1415 00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:25,729 I don't know anyone that's working on 1416 00:54:25,730 --> 00:54:26,730 that. 1417 00:54:31,540 --> 00:54:33,579 Does the Internet have a question? 1418 00:54:35,370 --> 00:54:37,769 Oh, it was just yawning, 1419 00:54:37,770 --> 00:54:40,129 OK, and then Mike four, please, 1420 00:54:41,490 --> 00:54:43,619 hey, hello, I'm just the 1421 00:54:43,620 --> 00:54:44,789 last one. 1422 00:54:44,790 --> 00:54:45,899 Yeah. 1423 00:54:45,900 --> 00:54:47,039 Thank you for your 1424 00:54:48,300 --> 00:54:49,289 interesting talk. 1425 00:54:49,290 --> 00:54:51,419 I never had this topic connected to art. 1426 00:54:51,420 --> 00:54:54,089 And I say same connecting 1427 00:54:54,090 --> 00:54:56,849 like the Estragon and 1428 00:54:56,850 --> 00:54:58,919 the queer 1429 00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,829 topic. I connected to an 1430 00:55:01,830 --> 00:55:03,239 biotics and everything. 1431 00:55:03,240 --> 00:55:04,649 And that makes me a little bit 1432 00:55:04,650 --> 00:55:05,650 questioning 1433 00:55:07,290 --> 00:55:08,579 when we are talking about the 1434 00:55:08,580 --> 00:55:09,599 antibiotics. I mean, 1435 00:55:11,580 --> 00:55:12,689 these are hormones. 1436 00:55:12,690 --> 00:55:13,649 They work as hormones. 1437 00:55:13,650 --> 00:55:15,029 But this is only one part. 1438 00:55:15,030 --> 00:55:17,339 How they in fact, our body, they are 1439 00:55:17,340 --> 00:55:19,979 also that they change our 1440 00:55:19,980 --> 00:55:22,829 calcium and our bones, 1441 00:55:22,830 --> 00:55:23,830 the brain, 1442 00:55:25,320 --> 00:55:27,479 the hormone, not only the immune 1443 00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:28,859 system, everything. 1444 00:55:28,860 --> 00:55:31,199 So if we are just thinking about 1445 00:55:31,200 --> 00:55:33,509 the kind of positive connected 1446 00:55:33,510 --> 00:55:36,329 effects about estrogen and 1447 00:55:36,330 --> 00:55:38,969 these antibiotics, 1448 00:55:38,970 --> 00:55:39,970 how do we 1449 00:55:41,100 --> 00:55:42,899 secure that? We don't lose the 1450 00:55:42,900 --> 00:55:44,879 precaution, but we should have about 1451 00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:46,730 biotics and actually 1452 00:55:47,830 --> 00:55:50,039 also don't think 1453 00:55:50,040 --> 00:55:52,109 that actually it's good that we have 1454 00:55:52,110 --> 00:55:54,150 these compounds in our environment. 1455 00:55:55,850 --> 00:55:58,279 Well, I'm not saying that it's good that 1456 00:55:58,280 --> 00:56:00,320 the toxicities are in the environment. 1457 00:56:01,330 --> 00:56:04,029 Um, well, but 1458 00:56:04,030 --> 00:56:06,339 I mean, the companies can use this 1459 00:56:06,340 --> 00:56:08,199 a little bit like when we were thinking, 1460 00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:10,599 OK, our our body is always 1461 00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:13,059 changing, we are always influenced 1462 00:56:13,060 --> 00:56:15,219 change. It can be the same 1463 00:56:15,220 --> 00:56:17,319 the same thinking 1464 00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:19,809 companies can use to justify 1465 00:56:19,810 --> 00:56:20,889 what they are doing. 1466 00:56:20,890 --> 00:56:22,159 Yeah. Yeah, exactly. 1467 00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:24,249 Oh yeah. I actually, um, 1468 00:56:24,250 --> 00:56:26,889 I was asked this one time in the past 1469 00:56:26,890 --> 00:56:29,019 from the artist, um he asked me 1470 00:56:29,020 --> 00:56:31,179 like what if companies 1471 00:56:31,180 --> 00:56:33,609 take my discourse of like 1472 00:56:33,610 --> 00:56:35,799 toxic emancipation or whatever and 1473 00:56:35,800 --> 00:56:37,449 and basically use that as a marketing 1474 00:56:37,450 --> 00:56:39,729 ploy, which I think would be really 1475 00:56:39,730 --> 00:56:42,819 like that would be fucked up, 1476 00:56:42,820 --> 00:56:43,820 but. 1477 00:56:45,830 --> 00:56:48,049 Yeah, I mean, you you see it, 1478 00:56:48,050 --> 00:56:50,419 you see it with, like marine pollution, 1479 00:56:50,420 --> 00:56:52,819 they call it, or oceanic 1480 00:56:52,820 --> 00:56:55,069 pollution. They call it marine debris, 1481 00:56:55,070 --> 00:56:56,719 like all the plastics in the ocean. 1482 00:56:56,720 --> 00:56:57,949 It's marine debris. 1483 00:56:57,950 --> 00:57:00,019 It's not anything 1484 00:57:00,020 --> 00:57:01,099 toxic, but. 1485 00:57:01,100 --> 00:57:02,100 Yeah. 1486 00:57:03,150 --> 00:57:05,309 I am kind of yeah, I am aware of 1487 00:57:05,310 --> 00:57:07,110 that and, um. 1488 00:57:09,240 --> 00:57:10,889 Yeah, it would be really fucked up if 1489 00:57:10,890 --> 00:57:13,269 they if they did that, um, 1490 00:57:13,270 --> 00:57:15,869 but again, I mean, these companies 1491 00:57:15,870 --> 00:57:18,029 have, uh, 1492 00:57:18,030 --> 00:57:20,459 all kinds of unlimited resources 1493 00:57:20,460 --> 00:57:22,929 at their disposal and, 1494 00:57:22,930 --> 00:57:23,930 uh. 1495 00:57:25,250 --> 00:57:27,170 Yeah, it's something to be cautious of. 1496 00:57:28,750 --> 00:57:29,750 Thank you. 1497 00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:34,969 So I think we're through 1498 00:57:34,970 --> 00:57:35,970 with Q&A, 1499 00:57:37,040 --> 00:57:38,329 thank you very much. 1500 00:57:38,330 --> 00:57:40,399 Thank you. Awesome talk. 1501 00:57:40,400 --> 00:57:42,649 And I hope you will really 1502 00:57:42,650 --> 00:57:43,849 impact the world with that. 1503 00:57:43,850 --> 00:57:44,850 Thanks.